Pathfinder 1E Is Pathfinder Sustainable in the Long-Term?

[Olaf the Stout]

I expect they will have 10k+ subscribers out of the gate. They might even get twice that you know. It's not impossible. Building on Dragon and Dungeon's converted subscriber base is a HUGE advantage.

Tough road? Sure.

Doomed? No.

You may be correct in stating that they will have 10k+ subscribers to begin with (I have no way of knowing is this figure is close to what their actual numbers are but your figure does seem plausible).

However I think that once people's "free" issues run out and/or the first AP is completed there will be a substantial number drop-off. I hope Paizo can figure out a way to keep these people subscribing but I have some doubts.

From a personal point of view, I haven't taken up a subscription to Pathfinder as yet but the chances are that I will do so before the first issue. If/when I do it will be partly because the new AP sounds very cool (and the authors are top shelf) and partly out of support to Paizo.

I don't know whether I will continue subscribing after the first AP though. It certainly won't be because I need another AP (I probably don't even need the Runelords).

Olaf the Stout

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

If someone isn't interested in the adventure(s) for a particular issue do you really think that they would still be willing to pay $20 for 50 pages worth of monsters, ecology, setting info, crunch, etc.? Personally I don't think a lot of people would. Of course I have been wrong before.

$14.

 

[Olaf the Stout]

$14.

$13.99 if you buy the PDF. $17.99 including shipping if you are a US subscriber, $18.99 including shipping if you are a non-US subscriber, $19.99 if you buy it at the regular retail price from your FLGS.

Olaf the Stout

 

[Sledge]

I'm a little disappointed in the subscription rates outlined for Pathfinder.... $1 an issue less than retail for me as a Canadian rather sucks. I save $12 per year with a subscription. Why bother? I think either they need to up their page count, or drop their price to succeed. I hope they do one or the other.

 

[Soel]

Paizo's already shown the ability to change when conditions do, which I would think is the number one trait to have in the rpg industry. Pathfinder as it looks now might not have the longest legs, but they can adapt it as time goes on. I think they'll be fine.

 

[Olaf the Stout]

Paizo's already shown the ability to change when conditions do, which I would think is the number one trait to have in the rpg industry. Pathfinder as it looks now might not have the longest legs, but they can adapt it as time goes on. I think they'll be fine.

I think if they adapt and are pro-active in making changes they will have a much better chance of making Pathfinder sustainable. I still wonder if the market is big enough to support something of Pathfinder's size on a monthly basis though.

Olaf the Stout

 

[morbiczer]

There is no question in my mind that this is a subscription "book" because there is a non-compete clause in the contract.

In a thread about the upcoming Monster Ecology Compilation someone from Paizo basicaly said that officially that was a "magazine" and not a "book", because their licence covered magazines. I guess almost everyone who would take a look at MEC would say that it is a book.

OTOH Pathfinder very much looks like a magazine to me.

All this does really suggest that they simply can't call it a magazine for legal reasons.

But it is also true that someone from Paizo soon after the announcment commented that they had thought about launching a new magazine, but they realised that the start up cost for a new product would be too high. (A million (millions? of) dollars were mentioned.)


Something else:

I agree with OP that one thing which for me is (so far) a serious bummer about Pathfinder is that it will feature only Adventure Path adventures. Two campaigns per year really sounds too much, even if some of them will finish before reaching level 20. If you for whatever reason don't like the actual AP, Paizo has lost you as a customer for PF for half a year.

I thing I really liked as a Hungarian is that overseas shipping will only be 1 dollar more expensive than US shipping.

 

[Radiating Gnome]

An interesting thing to watch will be looking at the way Pathfinder competes with the monthly parade of source books from WOTC. For my money, with a few exceptions, I've gotten far more from the adventure path adventures and articles than I have from the stacks of source books I've bought. And even if I don't use all of the APs they publish, the same way I haven't used anything close to all of the adventures printed in Dungeon, I'm still going to get a lot more use and enjoyment out of reading those adventures than I have from many of the splatbooks.

Frankly, I'm really looking forward to Pathfinder -- and it's odd to be as excited as I am about the prospect of it, given that it's rising from the ashes of Dragon and Dungeon.

-rg

 

[JoeGKushner]

It's not cheap.

But then again, BI has been charing pretty preimum prices for Warhammer material and Green Ronin's M&M line isn't inexpensive either.

The bigger problem I see is that it's similiar to a movie where the sequels may not get as much attention as the first one.

In addition, it's not Dragon or Dungeon. You could drift out of those magazines for years at a time and come back and catch up on 'em fairly inexpensively.

Next, I don't see it at Amazon.com. I keep hearing about the wonderful relationship they have with book vendors but if it ain't at Amazon.com for preorders... heck, I don't see a lot of Paizo stuff there.

In short, I think no. I'm really hoping the opposite mind you. It's easy to be cynical.

 

[Krolik]

1. Subscribers that switched their surplus Dragon and Dungeon subs find that Pathfinder doesn't fill the same role that the magazines did.

I agree with your points here. I think the first AP will be the flashiest to try and keep the subscriber so that they purchase through the first 6 - assuming most people's subscriptions will expire before the first 6 Pathfinders.

2. The price is too high.

I don't think it's priced too high. The real question is whether people who only have a $20.00 a month gaming budget will spend it on Pathfinder rather then something else. I generally buy 4-6 books a month. Making one of them Pathfinder isn't a big deal for me as long as I feel I'm getting use from the book.

I do think it's important for people to stop thinking about this like a magazine though. It's a 96 page full color book that contains a monthly module and campaign/world information. So what you're really getting is 40-50 pages of module each month and 40-50 pages of campaign info. I think people need to think about as if they were getting a monthly Dragonlance module and 40-50 pages of Gazetteer/campaign info in each book.

3. 2 adventure paths per year is too much.

This I agree with. I think after the first couple of series the book will probably need to shift into a monthly campaign sourcebook filling in more of the world and creatures for a series, then maybe jump back into another AP.

4. It is easy to lose subscribers for 6 months at a time.

I agree here as well, but I also think there are going to be people picking up random books because the particular adventure suits their needs in their own campaign. I also think Paizo is hoping the campaign information in the book will make people interested enough in the world to want to read more.

5. The WotC Digital Initiative.

I don't think it has any bearing at all. Pathfinder is a series of adventures tied to a specific game world. Pathfinder is not a monthly magazine. It's a monthly adventure and campaign information sourcebook. The articles in Pathfinder aren't about D&D. They're about the Pathfinder setting and world and how to get the most out of it when playing the adventures. I know I said it above but I'll repeat it. Pathfinder is like taking the 12 Dragonlance modules and the Dragonlance sourcebook and cramming it all into 6 sourcebooks and selling them one a month. People who want generic D&D/d20 will turn to DI. People who want to play in the Pathfinder universe will turn to it.