D&D 5E How would YOU nerf the wizard? +

Reynard

Legend
You don't think the way this thread is set up implies that wizards are the biggest problem and more important to fix than other casters? If so, I mis-read the issue and I apologize.
Wizards are the ones people complain about. I actually think the druid is the biggest problem: full caster plus shape shifting melee monster. Yuck. Take that back to the 1E druid whose shapeshifting was mostly utility.

Clerics would be a bigger problem, and they certainly have the potential to step on other niches, but they have a clearly defined role that means they have to reserve their power to heal and buff.
 

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dave2008

Legend
I have considered many things, but in practice I don't nerf our PCs wizard. Instead I essential nerf every other caster. So the most powerful caster outside our group's wizard is a 12th level cleric. Our wizard (lvl 15) is a good 5 levels more powerful than any other wizard in the world. I've nerfed the world around the PC, not the PC.
 

Reynard

Legend
I have considered many things, but in practice I don't nerf our PCs wizard. Instead I essential nerf every other caster. So the most powerful caster outside our group's wizard is a 12th level cleric. Our wizard (lvl 15) is a good 5 levels more powerful than any other wizard in the world. I've nerfed the world around the PC, not the PC.
How does that solve the problem of the pc wizard being too powerful compared to other PCs, or do you not see that problem in your game?
 



dave2008

Legend
How does that solve the problem of the pc wizard being too powerful compared to other PCs, or do you not see that problem in your game?
Well, let me clarify this a little bit. We game in a low magic setting, so our wizard cannot learn from a more powerful wizard or find more powerful spells at local wizard's guild or spell shop. So it is technically not a nerf, but getting spells above 3rd level is difficult and beyond 5th level nearly impossible. Just the 2 spells you get per level takes some serious research, money, and planning - they are not "free," you can't assume you learn them without any effort when you level up.*

*We have extensive downtime between levels for all PCs to gain the benefits of the next level.
 


Okay, real question:

For those who want to go back to True Vancian Casting: do you honestly feel this will be a serious check on the wizard's power considering it was present during the height of the wizard's power.... or do you just want it back because you liked playing that way?
Its a nerf compared to their current system, but it might be better-received by some of the people who traditionally oppose limitations on the wizard class because it was how they used to work.
It also emphasises the methodical nature of the class and the need for preparedness in a way that gives the wizard a more distinct spellcasting system than other classes while still highlighting the Wizard's core concept.
 

Reynard

Legend
Well, let me clarify this a little bit. We game in a low magic setting, so our wizard cannot learn from a more powerful wizard or find more powerful spells at local wizard's guild or spell shop. So it is technically not a nerf, but getting spells above 3rd level is difficult and beyond 5th level nearly impossible. Just the 2 spells you get per level takes some serious research, money, and planning - they are not "free," you can't assume you learn them without any effort when you level up.*

*We have extensive downtime between levels for all PCs to gain the benefits of the next level.
Do you curate the available spell list as well?
 

dave2008

Legend
How does that solve the problem of the pc wizard being too powerful compared to other PCs, or do you not see that problem in your game?
PS - is it ok to say how I would nerf wizards, but haven't done so? I took this thread to be things we have actually done, not simply ideas we have had. However, it seems like people are throwing out ideas and less actual experience.
 

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