Disarming a Bow with a Melee Weapon?

[Metalsmith]

Why sunder the bow when you can make the weapon inoperable by cutting the bowstring?

Cause thats called Sundering or striking a weapon.

Metalsmith

 

[Caliban]

Yes, but truestrike + disarm can work wonders.

 

[Metalsmith]

I was looking for a good rule in the eratta or FAQ or some other posting I might have missed aobut disarming a bow. and so far nothin. A flat out ruling of Bows Loose would be great.

I did occur to me perhaps another angle I was missing was instead of sundering or attacking a weapon, we could call it Attacking an Attended Object.

This may get alot eaiser cause suddenly the objects AC is 10 + the Weilders Dex + any Deflection Bonuses the Weilder may have + 5 if its held. No resisted rolls, just a hit and damage and done.
But then we have an uphill battle on our hands because a Bow is definitely a Weapon.

Crap thats not going to work either.

Metalsmith

 

[Gromm]

Input would be appreciated.

Could've fooled me.
Next time you ask for input don't put down every suggestion people give you.
We gave a few rules variants and different ideas, but you didn't like any of them. As far as Sundering magic bows, I think its pretty easy to have an equally, if not more magical sword. Since bows don't impart the enhancement bonus to thier ammo (for defeating say DR), most people save some money and get a fairly magical bow (with something like Flaming on it), and then some magic arrows (+1 or +2).
And just for the record, if your trying to take someones weapon out of thier hand, theres going to be an opposed attack roll of some sort. To do otherwise would be stupid (lvl 5 fighter disarms/sunders level 20 fighter- not happening). As it is Disarming and Sundering is too easy, making it easier is a Bad Idea.

 

[hong]

Given that the Sage has already stated that attacking a bow uses the "attack an object" rules, not the sundering rules, I'd say that disarming goes the same way as well. Make an attack roll against AC 10 + defender's Dex mod + size mod + deflection bonus + 5. If you succeed, you can choose either to damage the bow, or disarm the wielder.

(What would the size mod of a bow be? It's a "large" weapon, but it's only 6 feet long at most, which would be Medium.)

 

[Xarlen]

Lets see....
2 Hands, 1 on the Bow and 1 on the string, looks like using 2 hands to me. So he gets +4 for the 2 hander weapon. In Addtion because its a Large size weapon you have to use 2 hands to hold it beacuse its a Large weapon. So saying the string is not part of the bow is not going to work either.

I don't know about you, but if I'm holding onto a thin, taut wire, and someone tries to jerk that bow out've my hand with a yank from a polearm or sword, and I'm gripping that string, it's going to tear my hand up. The string isn't a very stable, supported place to hold. It's like carrying a crossbow by the drawn wire.

Edit: As a matter of fact, you're gripping that bow with Two Fingers. Two fingers. Now, I don't know how you hold a quarterstaff, but it's usually done with your entire hand, gripping tightly. That same support is not given to the bow.

Since bows don't impart the enhancement bonus to thier ammo (for defeating say DR), most people save some money and get a fairly magical bow (with something like Flaming on it), and then some magic arrows (+1 or +2).

Whoooh. Hold the monkey here. Where do you get That idea?
Bows have always imparted their stuff onto their ammo. Energy attacks, Holy, Bane, etc. When you fire a bow, those plusses add to you hitting, AND damaging. So, Why would the magical bonus not be added to the ammo? Please, show me where you're getting that impression.

 

[Baalzebul]

Please, show me where you're getting that impression.

DMG p183, Ranged Weapons and Ammunition:

However, for purposes of damage reduction, the enhancement bonuses of a magic ranged weapon and magic ammunition do not stack. Only the ammunition's enhancement bonus is applied against the damage reduction, since it is the only part of the weapon actually striking the creature.

 

[Xarlen]

Well, I'll be a goblin's uncle...

(And, I prefer Kobolds, so that's sayin' something!)

Edit: Hey! I think that could be used to support the Adamantite for Arrows arguement.

 

[jontherev]

I don't know about you, but if I'm holding onto a thin, taut wire, and someone tries to jerk that bow out've my hand with a yank from a polearm or sword, and I'm gripping that string, it's going to tear my hand up. The string isn't a very stable, supported place to hold. It's like carrying a crossbow by the drawn wire.

Edit: As a matter of fact, you're gripping that bow with Two Fingers. Two fingers. Now, I don't know how you hold a quarterstaff, but it's usually done with your entire hand, gripping tightly. That same support is not given to the bow.



Whoooh. Hold the monkey here. Where do you get That idea?
Bows have always imparted their stuff onto their ammo. Energy attacks, Holy, Bane, etc. When you fire a bow, those plusses add to you hitting, AND damaging. So, Why would the magical bonus not be added to the ammo? Please, show me where you're getting that impression.

You probably figured it out by now, but he's just referring to the bonuses not stacking for purposes of defeating DR. For damage and to hit, they stack just fine.

 

[Ridley's Cohort]

Whoooh. Hold the monkey here. Where do you get That idea?
Bows have always imparted their stuff onto their ammo. Energy attacks, Holy, Bane, etc. When you fire a bow, those plusses add to you hitting, AND damaging. So, Why would the magical bonus not be added to the ammo? Please, show me where you're getting that impression.

That is exactly his point. It is extremely efficient for an Archer to get a +1 energy energy weapon and (have someone) GMW the arrows. The average damage goes through the roof, and the enhancement of the arrows is all that matters for DR purposes.

Yes, the Archer could get a +3 bow for the same cost instead (assuming availability). He will hit slightly more often but his average damage will drop significantly.