Why is Polar Ray an 8th level spell?

[Corsair]

Whats the point of these damage caps really, just to make low level spells unviable at high level?

Basically.

Without those caps, casters would be even more powerful because they could last much longer against stronger opponents than they can now, further relegating warriors and non-magical combatants to a "stand in front of the wizard until the wizard kills them" role.

 

[mvincent]

Whats the point of these damage caps really, just to make low level spells unviable at high level?

Mostly. If for example, shocking grasp had no cap, it would take some of the joy out of learning/using spells higher than 1st level.

 

[jaelis]

Just for fun, try comparing polar ray to deadfall (SpC) sometime.

 

[VanRichten]

Hmm lets see.

20th Level Sorcerer
Rod of Greater Twinning
Sudden Maximize

vs

Fire Subtype Creature

Sorcerer hits creature for first effect dealing 180 damage and then again for 180 damage.

Total of 360hps of damage. Not too many creatures I know of that at that level can take that much damage all at once. So I can see why that spell is an 8th level spell.

And if you really want to be nasty. Make the Sorcerer a Archmage and have him convert the spell to energy its target is weak against or just sonic for anything else.

 

[jaelis]

Total of 360hps of damage. Not too many creatures I know of that at that level can take that much damage all at once. So I can see why that spell is an 8th level spell.

Delayed blast fireball would do the same damage to multiple creatures and has the handy delay feature.

 

[Starbuck_II]

Hmm lets see.

20th Level Sorcerer
Rod of Greater Twinning
Sudden Maximize

vs

Fire Subtype Creature

Sorcerer hits creature for first effect dealing 180 damage and then again for 180 damage.

Total of 360hps of damage. Not too many creatures I know of that at that level can take that much damage all at once. So I can see why that spell is an 8th level spell.

And if you really want to be nasty. Make the Sorcerer a Archmage and have him convert the spell to energy its target is weak against or just sonic for anything else.

What book has greater Twin Rod in it?
What about the Orb spells? Max 15d6. No SR.
You don't need sudden with them: you can use real Metamagic. Even add Split.

So Sorceror with:
(non-greater version)Rod of Twin/Split/Sudden Maximize:
Deals:
15d6=120 +120 =240 + twinned x2=480.
So we end up with a low level slot that deals 3/2rds more.
Yes, we used an additional feat, but it was worth it. We saved money on the rod, but used another feat.

 

[WhatGravitas]

Otherwise... uh... no clue.

Because cone of cold is 5th level.

Cheers, LT.

 

[darthkilmor]

Because cone of cold is 5th level.

Cheers, LT.

cone of cold is a , well, Cone, though. Polar Ray is a single target.

I ask about polar ray mainly because I have a player who wants to research a 3rd level spell that'll do cold damage, and was looking at the damage cap stuff and didnt really see any reason not to just remove it entirely. It makes lower level spells still viable and gives wizards more staying power. Instead of the "i'm out of 5th level spells, we've gotta camp", they can keep going. Character is only 7th level so its not like he'll be doing 25d6 anyway, just was looking for some kinda-comparable spells. Anyway, sorry for the off-topic, thats just the genesis of the question.

Comparing Polar Ray to Cone of Cold though, I could see polar ray as a decent 4th level spell. Single target vs 60ft cone of targets.

 

[the Jester]

It's simple: No save.

The touch attack thing is just a nod to balance at higher levels. Very few monsters have a touch AC of 20 or higher. Very few. The wizard ain't likely to miss, barring other defenses (miss chance, whatever).

No save, people. That's the reason it's 8th level.

 

[Enkhidu]

It's simple: No save.

The touch attack thing is just a nod to balance at higher levels. Very few monsters have a touch AC of 20 or higher. Very few. The wizard ain't likely to miss, barring other defenses (miss chance, whatever).

No save, people. That's the reason it's 8th level.

It gets worse when you assume that at higher levels SOP for a wizard is to quicken True Strikes.