D&D 2E What does AD&D 2E do better than 5E?

[MGibster]

One of the things I liked about 2nd edition were the non-weapon profeciencies. If I wanted my Fighter to be a naturalist making sketches of creatures he encountered, if I gave him some skill in art then I could assume he was good at being an artist. I don't really make the same assumption in 5th edition because skills are directly linked to an attribute.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

I think 2E's big advantage is the quantity of TSR-created material. Today's OSR scene now produces more D&D-compatible material in a single year than TSR did during its entire lifespan, but it tends to have a different flavor -- more gonzo, often more gritty -- than the 2E stuff.

That said, I think the actual 2E rules were often rough around the edges, rarely balanced, and still had too many charts to look up things in the middle of the game (although obviously it was better than 1E was in that regard).

If I were inclined to play a 2E game again, I'd probably get a good retroclone or a non-retroclone 2E compatible OSR game that cleaned up the ruleset a little, reorganized things and maybe tweaked a few of the game's issues, and use that to run 2E settings and adventures with.

 

[Voadam]

One of the things I liked about 2nd edition were the non-weapon profeciencies. If I wanted my Fighter to be a naturalist making sketches of creatures he encountered, if I gave him some skill in art then I could assume he was good at being an artist. I don't really make the same assumption in 5th edition because skills are directly linked to an attribute.

I am not certain I understand your distinction, 2e NWPs were mostly directly linked to attributes as well. The two exceptions in the 2e PH are blindfighting and mountaineering.

To make a naturalist in 2e with NWPs I would take the warrior class animal lore NWP which uses an intelligence check, it seems to be the closest thing on the list.

 

[Voadam]

dwarves only detected stonework pits

It was a bit better than that.

"Detect stonework traps, pits, and deadfalls 1–3 on 1d6"

So any trap involving stonework.

 

[Malerai_Kayne]

Some very good points here that mirror a lot of what we see as well. We often find ourselves going back and forth between 5E and 2E in terms of which edition does what better. I think the overall gist is that 5E is a cleaner, more logical system at its core, but 2E, despite its idiosyncracies, still manages to deliver the "better" game experience, at least for me (due to a lot of the points made above). I am currently prepping to run Goodman Games' 5E version of Temple of Elemental Evil and am heavily modifying the 5E rules for that, hence my question. Crazy as it might be, the goal is to keep the very core structure of 5E but change the rest to deliver a comparable gaming experience (without simply copying rules; more 2E interpreted through a 5E lens).

I am curious, though. Some of you mentioned specialty priests being better at differentiating faiths and clerics. Are we talking Faiths & Avatars kind of priests or simply access to spheres?

 

[Sacrosanct]

I am curious, though. Some of you mentioned specialty priests being better at differentiating faiths and clerics. Are we talking Faiths & Avatars kind of priests or simply access to spheres?

How the 2e priest was built felt pretty distinct between spheres. Each priest had major access to around 3-5 (IIRC) major spheres, and a few minor ones. You could cast any spell from a major sphere, and were limited to level 3 spells or lower for minor spheres. So you couldn't prep every cleric spell. Like 5e, your weapons and armor were based on ethos, and you got high powers, medium powers, and low powers. Kinda like 5e subclass abilities I guess, but 2e felt more varied and flavorful.

Technically I suppose they were more limited than 5e (because of sphere limitation), but that made them all feel distinct. In 5e, regardless of your subclass, you still spammed bless, guidance, spiritual weapon, and healing word. You didn't (couldn't) do that in 2e.

 

[Voadam]

I am curious, though. Some of you mentioned specialty priests being better at differentiating faiths and clerics. Are we talking Faiths & Avatars kind of priests or simply access to spheres?

For me I was specifically referring to specialty priests so the low powered ones from Complete Priest's Handbook, the higher powered ones in Legends and Lore, Forgotten Realms Adventures, Faiths & Avatars, Powers & Pantheons, Demihuman Deities, Monster Mythology, Greyhawk From the Ashes, and others.

Full Classes with widely varying mechanics. 2e has lots of them and they can be very different from the base Norman knight vampire hunter sworn not to draw blood so they use bone breaking blunt maces type of core cleric.

If I want a fire cultist sorcerer priest then I would generally prefer to grab a fire god specialty priest rather than a fire domain type cleric.

 

[MGibster]

I am not certain I understand your distinction, 2e NWPs were mostly directly linked to attributes as well. The two exceptions in the 2e PH are blindfighting and mountaineering.

You're right! It's been about 26 years since I've cracked open a copy of AD&D 2nd edition and my memory is fuzzy.

 

[Voadam]

You're right! It's been about 26 years since I've cracked open a copy of AD&D 2nd edition and my memory is fuzzy.

There also was the other optional 2e skill system of secondary skills where you chose a background profession and you were considered competent at that area.

It was basically the same system as the option from the 1e DMG.

I find these systems and 5e's background fairly straight forward and appealing. They don't provide specific mechanics, but they give a narrative hook for specific competencies and to riff off of in a game.

 

[deganawida]

One thing to remember regarding NWPs and secondary skills in 2nd was that you weren’t supposed to be a master of these non-adventuring professions. Instead, your profession was adventurer, and that meant less time to master sculpting, obscure history, and so forth. Unlike the inestimable Dr. Jones, whose day job was archaeology professor, it was expected that adventuring PC spent most of their time and energy into exploring forgotten ruins, battling evil, and saving the town/kingdom//world/cosmos. That leaves little time for improving one’s skills at the forge. That’s the reasoning behind there being no increases beyond unlocking it or raising your attributes. The only ones who could improve were supposed to be retired adventurers.