Type | AC | Hit Points | STR | DEX | CON | INT | WIS | CHA | Challenge |
---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
Black | 16 | 65 (10d8+20) | 18 (+4) | 15 (+2) | 14 (+2) | 4 (–3) | 13 (+1) | 11 (+0) | 3 (700 XP) |
Blue | 17 | 71 (11d8+22) | 18 (+4) | 10 (+0) | 15 (+2) | 6 (–2) | 15 (+2) | 13 (+1) | 4 (1,100 XP) |
Green | 17 | 71 (11d8+22) | 18 (+4) | 12 (+1) | 14 (+2) | 5 (–3) | 13 (+1) | 11 (+0) | 4 (1,100 XP) |
Red | 19 | 82 (11d8+33) | 18 (+4) | 10 (+0) | 17 (+3) | 8 (–1) | 15 (+2) | 14 (+2) | 5 (1,800 XP) |
White | 16 | 60 (8d8+24) | 18 (+4) | 10 (+0) | 17 (+3) | 3 (–4) | 12 (+1) | 9 (–1) | 3 (700 XP) |
Brass | 16 | 65 (10d8+20) | 18 (+4) | 10 (+0) | 14 (+2) | 7 (–2) | 13 (+1) | 11 (+0) | 3 (700 XP) |
Bronze | 18 | 75 (10d8+30) | 18 (+4) | 10 (+0) | 17 (+3) | 8 (–1) | 15 (+2) | 13 (+1) | 4 (1,100 XP) |
Copper | 17 | 65 (10d8+20) | 18 (+4) | 10 (+0) | 15 (+2) | 7 (–2) | 13 (+1) | 12 (+1) | 3 (700 XP) |
Gold | 20 | 90 (12d8+36) | 18 (+4) | 14 (+2) | 17 (+3) | 9 (–1) | 15 (+2) | 14 (+2) | 6 (2,300 XP) |
Silver | 19 | 82 (11d8+33) | 18 (+4) | 12 (+1) | 17 (+3) | 8 (–1) | 15 (+2) | 13 (+1) | 5 (1,800 XP) |
Type | Element | Saves & Skills² | Hit | Damage (with Longsword) |
---|---|---|---|---|
Black | acid | DEX +4, CON +4, WIS +3, CHA +2 | +6 | 13 (1d10+4 slashing & 1d6 acid) |
Blue | lightning | DEX +2, CON +4, WIS +4, CHA +3 | +6 | 13 (1d10+4 slashing & 1d6 lightning) |
Green | poison¹ | DEX +3, CON +4, WIS +3, CHA +2 | +6 | 13 (1d10+4 slashing & 1d6 poison) |
Red | fire | DEX +3, CON +6, WIS +5, CHA +5 | +7 | 18 (1d10+1d6+4 slashing & 2d4 fire) |
White | cold | DEX +2, CON +5, WIS +3, CHA +1 | +6 | 13 (1d10+4 slashing & 1d6 cold) |
Brass | fire | DEX +2, CON +4, WIS +3, CHA +2 | +6 | 9½ (1d10+4 slashing) |
Bronze | lightning | DEX +2, CON +5, WIS +4, CHA +3 | +6 | 9½ (1d10+4 slashing) |
Copper | acid | DEX +2, CON +4, WIS +3, CHA +3 | +6 | 9½ (1d10+4 slashing) |
Gold | fire | DEX +5, CON +6, WIS +5, CHA +5 | +7 | 13 (1d10+1d6+4 slashing) |
Silver | cold | DEX +4, CON +6, WIS +5, CHA +4 | +7 | 12 (1d10+1d4+4 slashing) |
Armor Class 18 (natural armor) if black, blue, bronze, gold, green, red or silver; 17 (natural armor) if white, brass or copper
As for the "broadsword" I guess that could be part of the Dragon Warrior's body too. Or we could just give it a Longsword or Greatsword as those are the commonest hefty sword in 5E.
Agreed.Well I doubt he meant someone could yank a fang out of the dragon's mouth, shout it's name and hey-presto you've got a Dragon Warrior.
My thinking was the original monster was clearly some sort of one-use magic item analogous to a disposable figurine of wondrous power, some of which had limited uses (i.e. a goat of terror only functioned three times then "loses its magical ability forever" per the 1E Dungeon Master's Guide.
So I'd say they are magic items made from the canines of a dragon, so no more than four can be made from one dragon.
Elegant.Well an identify might just give the caster the knowledge of the command word that activates the fang rather than the proper true name of the dragon. It's just the command word defaults to some casual or use-name of the dragon in question.
Heh. Never even noticed the brass dragon thing. But then I always use my own edited versions of the monsters I run. Since I must have rewritten the 2E dragons a gazillion times to include all information available, the mistake probably disappeared without me even noticing.Well Dragons did get a significant power boost in the switch from 1E to 2E so that's hardly surprising. In the 1977 Monster Manual all age categories of dragon had the same Armour Class, so a Red Dragon was AC –1 whether it was a wyrmling and a great wyrm. In 2E AD&D, a Young dragon has the same AC as a 1E dragon, but younger and older dragon's have better or worse AC based on their Hit Die Modifiers.
Annoyingly, the Dragon, General entry of the Monstrous Compendium and Monstrous Manual are very bad at explaining this, and the example in MC1 - Monstrous Compendium Volume One (1989) got its sums wrong: a juvenile Brass Dragon is AC 0 and a Very Old one is AC –5 not the –4 it claims, since Very Old is 5 age categories better than Juvenile. The Dragon, Brass entry in MC1 shows the correct ACs for all a 2E Brass's age categories.
I suppose 5E Wyrmling equals 2E Hatchling and therefore 5E Young Dragon = 2E Very Young dragon?For our conversion I'd either give them the AC of one of the lower age ranks, like Wyrmling or Young, whichever we feel is appropriate.
Let's see, in In 5E those are:
Dragon Wyrmling Young Dragon Black AC 17 AC 18 Blue AC 17 AC 18 Green AC 17 AC 18 Red AC 17 AC 18 White AC 16 AC 17 Brass AC 16 AC 17 Bronze AC 17 AC 18 Copper AC 16 AC 17 Gold AC 17 AC 18 Silver AC 17 AC 18
So either 16 or 17 if we use a Wyrmling or 17 or 18 for a Young Dragon. I'd lean towards the latter.
Yup. I'd do it in a table for 2E, but then 2E does things in tables.That does raise an issue. It seems more trouble than it's worth to have ten Dragon Warrior entries, one for each of the ten 10 standard types of Dragon (i.e. a Black Dragon Warrior, Red Dragon Warrior, et cetera.) so I'm rather fold them all into one entry.
Which means it'd need something like:
Armor Class 18 (natural armor) if black, blue, bronze, gold, green, red or silver; 17 (natural armor) if white, brass or copperDamage Immunities acid if black or copper; cold if silver or white; fire if brass, gold or red; lightning if blue or bronze; poison if green
Mine, too.My preference would be to stat them up as a monster of some kind and have the "dragon warrior's fang" be a single use magic item that just summons, creates or conjures a dragon warrior for X period of time.
Isn't there something like "magical creation" or "summoned creature"?Not sure what type would make the most sense for them. Humanoid might work, as would Monstrosity, but other types don't feel quite right.
I agree on not making them constructs, first because the original doesn't really state as much and then because this would make them too powerful (as per your "flesh golem" above).Don't want to go overboard on the immunities. These are comparatively low-powered critters and I'm not convinced they are constructs, so I wouldn't support giving it immunity to charmed, exhaustion, frightened, paralyzed, petrified, poisoned like a 5E Flesh Golem
Also, these are comparable to a figurine of wondrous power and the creatures those figurines create don't have any extra immunities: a bronze griffon is just a Griffon, for example. The only 5E figurine in the SRD with immunities is the obsidian steed, but that's because it turns into a Nightmare and those monsters possess fire immunity.
The original's immunity to sleep, charm and hold was one of the standard immunity sets of undead or constructs. Most constructs and undead don't have many immunities in 5E. A standard Skeleton, for example, is just immune to poison and exhaustion.
The 5E sleep spell doesn't affect creature immune to being charmed, and the hold spells cause the target to be paralyzed. So if we gave them:
Condition Immunities charmed, paralyzed; plus poisoned if green
Then that'd roughly duplicate the immunities of the original Dragon Warriors. It's worth noting that Dragons had immunity to paralysis in some editions of D&D.
In 1E and 2E, armor made from dragon hide used to be much like scale mail armor (e.g., Roger Moore, Bazaar of the Bizarre – Evil Dragon Armors, in: Dragon 62). Is there something like it in 5E?The original text says "The warriors are clad in exceptionally complete scale armour, colour and armour class equating with that of their “parent” dragon" and are usually armed with broadswords (a weapon that doesn't exist in the 5E SRD). The illustration shows the Warriors with Heater Shields but they're also clearly wearing full Renaissance period plate armor rather than the scale they're stated to wear.
Also, note that the text makes no mention of shields, they're only in the illustration. The Dragon Warrior might not be supposed to have one.
Now Scale Armor is a Medium Armor with base AC 14. As Medium armor, the max Dex bonus to AC is +2 for AC 16, so if the Warrior doesn't have a shield then it must get a +1 or +2 bonus from something else to get the AC 17 or 18 I'm aiming for.
I suppose these could be suits of +1 scale armor or +2 scale armor as they're "exceptionally complete", whatever that means.
Armor Class #2 [with DEX 14-15 (+2)] 18 (+2 scale armor) if black, blue, bronze, gold, green, red or silver; 17 (+1 scale armor) if white, brass or copper
Or it could have a DEX modifier of +0 or +1 and use a shield as shown in the illustration.
Armor Class #3 [with DEX 12-13 (+1)] 18 (+1 scale armor, shield) if black, blue, bronze, gold, green, red or silver; 17 (scale armor, shield) if white, brass or copperArmor Class #4 [with DEX 10-11 (+0)] 18 (+2 scale armor, shield) if black, blue, bronze, gold, green, red or silver; 17 (+1 scale armor, shield) if white, brass or copper
However, I prefer the current (natural armor) version. Perhaps the "exceptionally complete scale armor" is really the Dragon Warrior's actual skin, which is plated in immensely large and strong scales that just happens to look like a suit of armor.
As for the "broadsword" I guess that could be part of the Dragon Warrior's body too. Or we could just give it a Longsword or Greatsword as those are the commonest hefty sword in 5E.
Since the dragon warriors seem to be based on Greek myth (or least seem to be in case of the WD version), maybe the author meant a broadsword known as the rhomphaia (Greek single-edged straight or slightly curved broadsword (blade 60–80 cm) for slashing (primary) and thrusting; wiki)?I guess theWhateversword doesn't have to follow the standard Weapon table rules if it's a monstrous ability, no more than the Longsword and Whip of a Balor are normal versions of those weapons.
I suppose 5E Wyrmling equals 2E Hatchling and therefore 5E Young Dragon = 2E Very Young dragon?
Seeing as that the 1E dragon's AC (typically) went to become that of the 2E Very Young dragon, giving the 5E dragon warriors the 5E Young Dragon AC would, indeed, seem to be the way to go.
Isn't there something like "magical creation" or "summoned creature"?
That leaves the "strange" immunities to sleep, charm, and hold, which, indeed, typically were signs of undeath or being-a-construct in early D&D. However, these immunities can also be read as a non-intelligent creature/entity simply not having a brain as old school PCs recognized it - making that it cannot be influenced as if it had one.
So I'd explain away these immunities as being due to this rather than anything else - which, admittedly, also makes them immune to various other mind-affecting spells and effects.
Am I correct in understanding that 5E hold effects lead to actual physical paralysis (in as that your body ceases to function) as opposed to your mind telling you that you cannot move?
If so, and in the light of possibly explaining the immunities through "having no brain", I'd say that adding immunity to 5E paralysis would be giving dragon warriors a defense they don't have in the original (e.g., against paralyzing poisons or nerve damage).
Anyway. That's the 2E converter speaking. I don't know if making dragon warriors "magical creations powered by magic instead of an actual brain" is at all possible in 5E monster making.
Dragons immune to paralysis? Is that post-2E?
In 1E and 2E, armor made from dragon hide used to be much like scale mail armor (e.g., Roger Moore, Bazaar of the Bizarre – Evil Dragon Armors, in: Dragon 62). Is there something like it in 5E?
Since the dragon warriors seem to be based on Greek myth (or least seem to be in case of the WD version), maybe the author meant a broadsword known as the rhomphaia (Greek single-edged straight or slightly curved broadsword (blade 60–80 cm) for slashing (primary) and thrusting; wiki)?