D&D 5E Warlocks and Multiclassing

[Xeviat]

Hey everyone. How do Warlocks work out multiclassing, beyond a few level dips. Unlike other spellcasters, Pact casting doesn't exactly add together with your caster levels, so you don't get higher level slots. You have tons of low level slots, though. If it wasn't for there being plenty of damaging spells on the Warlock's spell list, I'd be tempted to think of them as a non-caster with their fighter comparable eldritch blast damage. A 10/10 Wizard/Cleric gets 5th level spells in both classes and full up to 9th level spell slots, yet a 10/10 Warlock/Wizard gets up to 5th level slots, but has a ton of them throughout a day with 2 short rests.

Do you think there's another way to do it? Off the cuff, I'm wondering if this would be possible:

Pact Magic and Multiclassing: If you have both the Spellcasting class feature and the Pact Magic class feature from the warlock class, total your levels to determine your total spell slots. Your Pact Magic feature allows you to recover spell slots on a short rest; after a short rest, you regain a number of slots equal to the Warlock's "spell slots" column for your level of slot level determined by the warlock's "slot level" column on their class table. Ignore the "Mystic Arcanum" class features, as they overlap with this.

Yes, this is a strict power up, but I think it's a power up to builds that are strictly ignored. It's also my first stab at this. What are your thoughts?

 

[famousringo]

Doesn't work at all.

Let's say I'm a level 10 warlock, and normally I'd be really excited to hit level 11 and get my third slot, but why would I when I can take a single level of sorcerer under your house rule and, BAM, 16 spell slots just like that.

Basically, you will guarantee that all warlocks will multiclass eventually while giving them a tremendous power boost over any other caster, because warlock levels essentially give you double spellcasting with this scheme.

The fact is, a 10/10 warlock is not really any weaker than any other 10/10 caster. They're all weak because they forgo high level spells, not because of how they tally their spell slots. Upranking level 5 spells isn't really more powerful than casting a lot of them.

 

[Ancalagon]

I must admit, thematically speaking, a multi class warlock / other caster really bothers me. The warlock is the classical "deal with the devil" caster - someone who makes a pact with a dangerous or mysterious entity to obtain eldritch power. Does such a character have room in a game of d&d ? Of course !

But the multi classing with another casting class breaks the theme. If the character could obtain magical powers through study, innate power, worship of a deity, nature etc... Why on earth does he or she make the pact?!?

 

[TwoSix]

That would give every warlock full spell slot progression (not spell progression, but slots) for a one-level dip of any caster class. Seems overly strong to me.

Probably the first thing to do is to decide exactly what kind of spell availability and spell slots you think a Warlock 10/Wizard 10 should have, and then figure out how to make that happen, rules wise. Then make sure that rules doesn't break for Warlock 19/Wizard 1 and Warlock 1/Wizard 19.

 

[lowkey13]

*Deleted by user*

 

[nswanson27]

I must admit, thematically speaking, a multi class warlock / other caster really bothers me. The warlock is the classical "deal with the devil" caster - someone who makes a pact with a dangerous or mysterious entity to obtain eldritch power. Does such a character have room in a game of d&d ? Of course !

But the multi classing with another casting class breaks the theme. If the character could obtain magical powers through study, innate power, worship of a deity, nature etc... Why on earth does he or she make the pact?!?

It's been stated elsewhere, but there's nothing that says that pacts are necessarily voluntary. There's also the whole "oathbreaker" archetype in other classes, that could easily be extended here, albeit in a lesser form.

 

[lowkey13]

*Deleted by user*

 

[TwoSix]

The way you go partly depends on the focus of your table. Is your table primarily "crunch/numbers" focused, or RP focused?

Like your footnote indicated, the two don't have to be mutually exclusive. Even as a powergamer, I still always work through my character concept to make sure everything hangs together.

I'd also note that one can be even a pure roleplayer and still not take the PHB fluff as anything more than a suggestion. In my own home games, for example, we don't have any sort of broad pantheon, no matter who's DMing. The players are always free to make up a diety, or cult, or spirit, or even philosophy that are the source of their divine power. (My minotaur cleric was member of the Cult of the Blue Oyster, for example.) And we tend to run warlock pacts more as a tapping into a source of power, rather than something transactional with a possibly-to-probably malign entity. In our last campaign, to give yet another example, all halflings in the world looked and dressed exactly the same (blonde bowl cuts and wearing leiderhosen). We had a halfling warlock that was a Great Old One pact, but roleplayed as the halfling as a semi-autonomous agent of the halfling collective Borg mind (bonus for creepy telepathy and mind-control powers).

 

[lowkey13]

*Deleted by user*

 

[hejtmane]

I mean I can think of a ton of reason for multiclassing with Warlock from an RP perspective. Vengeance Paladin he takes an oath with a patron to help him seek his end goal of vengeance what ever his personal cost. Solomon Kane concept if you like.


How about someone making a deal they started as a Sorcerer or Bard and on an adventure they where about to die and made a pact that saved their life but now they are pact bound.

I mean RP wise multi-classing makes sense; one of my favorite parts of 5E is multiclass it is easy but their is a trade off some good some bad to some people the trade off is worth it even if they are doing a high level campaign