D&D 5E The "Bonus" Turn for high Initiative

[DND_Reborn]

So, it's great to have a good initiative modifier, right? Well, I guess, at least for that first round... but after that, it is really inconsequential. With the RAW system of cyclical initiative, it is always "you go, they go, you go, they go..." and so on.

But, what about if a high modifier could actually give you an "extra" turn the first round? The idea is this:

You roll initiative as normal. If your total is above 20, you get to act again, gaining a complete extra turn, at 20 below your total. After this, you act on the 20 less total for the remainder of the encounter.

I think the idea is straight forward, but here is an example:

A: 24
B: 21
C: 19
D: 13
E: 2

A would get to act on 24 and again on 4. After the first round, A would have to decide to act on 24 or 4 for the rest of the combat. B would act on 21 and on 1, also having to decide to act on 21 or 1 for the remainder of the battle.

A-1: 24
B-1: 21
C: 19
D: 13
A-2: 4
E: 2
B-2: 1

Now, of course this would make certain features VERY good under the right conditions, and I get that. But it has been my experience with cyclical initiative that getting a good bonus isn't as important really unless your class features (such as assassinate) really depend on going first. But even then, you only benefit from those features once.

Open for discussion: is this a decent idea? too much/OP? I am toying with it for now, and would like some constructive feedback (please not just "this is a bad idea"--tell me why! ).

 

[Immoralkickass]

So if the BBEG rolls 20+, its going to be a tpk then?

 

[coolAlias]

Going first is generally extremely advantageous - not only do you go first on the first round, but every subsequent round as well.

This means you are often able to disable / kill one or more opponents before they can act on any given round, which of course leads to much less damage taken by the party.

Granting a full extra turn on the first round would be extremely powerful, not only because you go first, but because you then go last and then in probably 99.999% of cases you'd go again immediately. In 5e, a good offense really is the best defense.

What one of my groups did and enjoyed was to have the entire group declare their action at the start of each round, then re-roll initiative. The DM of course should decide what the NPCs are going to do and inform the players of anything that would be obvious and might affect PC decisions, e.g. "the orcs begin moving toward you, axes raised."

It's not the fastest and has its idiosyncracies, but it really puts that chaotic feeling back into combat akin to AD&D.

 

[DND_Reborn]

So if the BBEG rolls 20+, its going to be a tpk then?

Extremely doubtful. If your BBEG can wipe a party in two turns, you might want to re-evaluate what you are throwing your PCS up against.

 

[coolAlias]

Extremely doubtful. If your BBEG can wipe a party in two turns, you might want to re-evaluate what you are throwing your PCS up against.

It might not be a TPK, but I'd caution you not to underestimate the advantage of both going first AND having two turns the first round.

At least one PC could very easily die in such circumstances, especially if it's not their first fight of the day.

 

[DND_Reborn]

Going first is generally extremely advantageous - not only do you go first on the first round, but every subsequent round as well.

This is the misconception. After the first turn in cyclical initiative, it really doesn't matter due to the I go-you go cycle.

This means you are often able to disable / kill one or more opponents before they can act on any given round, which of course leads to much less damage taken by the party.

Granting a full extra turn on the first round would be extremely powerful, not only because you go first, but because you then go last and then in probably 99.999% of cases you'd go again immediately. In 5e, a good offense really is the best defense.

What one of my groups did and enjoyed was to have the entire group declare their action at the start of each round, then re-roll initiative. The DM of course should decide what the NPCs are going to do and inform the players of anything that would be obvious and might affect PC decisions, e.g. "the orcs begin moving toward you, axes raised."

It's not the fastest and has its idiosyncracies, but it really puts that chaotic feeling back into combat akin to AD&D.

My first instinct was that you would go afterwards on the lower count to prevent the going last and going again (on the original total) the second round. I'll edit the OP to reflect this.

 

[Ancalagon]

You do get a bonus turn though - the combat ends somewhere in the middle of a round - whoever went before that end of combat moment has had a turn more than those who haven't gone in the round yet - they will not get to.

 

[DND_Reborn]

It might not be a TPK, but I'd caution you not to underestimate the advantage of both going first AND having two turns the first round.

At least one PC could very easily die in such circumstances, especially if it's not their first fight of the day.

Characters very rarely die in 5E, at least after tier 1 IME. But, if you think it is too much, that is cool. Maybe just an extra action instead of an entire turn? It isn't a huge difference, but it might be significant.

 

[DND_Reborn]

You do get a bonus turn though - the combat ends somewhere in the middle of a round - whoever went before that end of combat moment has had a turn more than those who haven't gone in the round yet - they will not get to.

Interesting POV...

So, in other words, higher initiative always gets to go "last" since the others won't get to act at all-- the "bonus turn" comes at the end of the fight.

My only caveat is this: "provided you survive to the end (or are conscious and still in the fight)."

I'd rather it come earlier, personally. I like other systems, such as Shadowrun 2E, that rewards high initiative with extra actions. In that game, "speed" really kills LOL! I wouldn't want a bonus every round, though, so I thought just in the first round would work well.

 

[coolAlias]

This is the misconception. After the first turn in cyclical initiative, it really doesn't matter due to the I go-you go cycle.

I disagree. Yes, initiative is cyclical, but if someone's dead or disabled before their turn comes up again due to the people that acted before them in a round, how is that not an advantage to going first?

My first instinct was that you would go afterwards on the lower count to prevent the going last and going again (on the original total) the second round. I'll edit the OP to reflect this.

That would be much more acceptable - in this case, only the slowest of the bunch would be punished:

A=24
B, C...
A = 4
D = 1
// new round
B, C...
A = 4
D = 1

Characters very rarely die in 5E, at least after tier 1 IME. But, if you think it is too much, that is cool. Maybe just an extra action instead of an entire turn? It isn't a huge difference, but it might be significant.

I mean, I do think it is too much of an advantage, but with your edit, I'd say go ahead and try it at your table and see how it goes. Perhaps your group's play style will benefit from it.