Systems That Model The World Rather Than The Story

[Thomas Shey]

Are there any recent games in this mold?

Depends to what degree they have to to count. Also whether you count newer editions of older games.

 

[Thomas Shey]

True.

I've said this before, but I find the idea of "simulationistic superheroes" rather appealing. What would really happen if people had such powers and how would they really function when we do away with genre conventions and plot contrivances and model the physics and the society realistically?
I guess the Boys is one answer to this, although I'm not sure results necessarily need to be quite that bleak.

There are games that deal with super powers without as much of the genre conventions; Wild Talents is one of them, and a more severe case is the EABA game Eschaton come to mind, as does the AMP:Year One series of games.

The issue is, of course, they aren't really "superhero" games to one degree or another; there may be people who have somewhat superhero like look-and-feel, but they're really people-with-powers games, and that's a fairly distinct look. That's because to a large degree once you get away from those conventions, operating like what we think of as superheroes doesn't make too much sense, even if its just some of the social conventions.

 

[Thomas Shey]

The original Aberrant was in this vein, and even bleaker than The Boys.

Well, part of that was because of certain dark elements baked into quantum powers, though (though some of it was socio-political too, but even if those had gone less that way the whole "everyone with quantum powers is on the road to mutation and madness" wasn't going to help).

 

[pemerton]

In regard to modeling the world, one thing that I haven't seen very much of (though instances of it are out there) is methods of generating relatively large-scale events in order to portray a dynamic world, i.e. things are happening even if the PCs don't interact with them.

You mostly get this as "random events" at domain-level play, where the GM will roll on a table for something to happen, either as part of the PCs' fief or abroad. But it applies to a lot of other things, such as random weather tables (which can be a lot of fun if used correctly, albeit more so in low-level/magic games), or even an economic fluctuation system I once saw.

Torchbearer 2e has all this.

 

[Reynard]

In regard to modeling the world, one thing that I haven't seen very much of (though instances of it are out there) is methods of generating relatively large-scale events in order to portray a dynamic world, i.e. things are happening even if the PCs don't interact with them.

That's not really what I mean by modeling the world in this context. I mean sim based rules, as opposed to drama or genre based rules. Stuff like "you can carry 37.4 pounds of gear, make sure to write it all down" versus "roll 1d6 whenever you light a torch; if you roll a 1 it is your last torch".

 

[mamba]

I don’t think you can completely separate the physics from the genre, so a universal engine is impossible / strong in some genres, weak in others / not universal but modular.

I am also not sure where you draw the line between engine and ruleset. Is it just the level of granularity/ detail to track?

 

[Reynard]

I don’t think you can completely separate the physics from the genre, so a universal engine is impossible / strong in some genres, weak in others / not universal but modular.

I am also not sure where you draw the line between engine and ruleset. Is it just the level of granularity/ detail to track?

Sure, and even "sim" games often make concessions ("Use this optional rule to give the game a more heroic flavor" or whatever). But by and large, I think there is value in a game system that leans into the immersive aspects of the world, as opposed to the tropes of the genre or the beats of a story. Obviously it is just about preference. I think story is something that happens naturally through play and you do not need "story mechanics" for that.

Of course, no game system can serve as a physics engine for the whole universe so i think it is best when folks can assume things work like our world, except where they explicitly don't. Your character can carry X weight because of their strength score, but it is still reasonable for the GM to make you buy a backpack or so you can't move that really unwieldy thing even if you are strong enough. Similarly, there might be rules for specific magical diseases in the game, but that doesn't mean your character can't get a cold, dysentery or gangrene.

 

[Umbran]

I guess the Boys is one answer to this, although I'm not sure results necessarily need to be quite that bleak.

Well, if it is a simulation of what would "really" happen, you don't get much choice in the matter. If you instead set a level on how bleak it is, then that becomes a genre conceit.

 

[Crimson Longinus]

Well, if it is a simulation of what would "really" happen, you don't get much choice in the matter. If you instead set a level on how bleak it is, then that becomes a genre conceit.

Any simulation of fictional has to make some assumptions. It's not like we have a perfect god-mind super computer who can tell us what "really would happen." Also, in the Boys a big source of the dystopian elements is that the source of the superpowers is an evil megacorporation. With different initial assumptions we get different end results. Though I have do doubt that any remotely realistic scenario would be somewhat bleak, because the real life is bleak.

 

[mamba]

I think there is value in a game system that leans into the immersive aspects of the world, as opposed to the tropes of the genre or the beats of a story. Obviously it is just about preference. I think story is something that happens naturally through play and you do not need "story mechanics" for that.

Of course, no game system can serve as a physics engine for the whole universe so i think it is best when folks can assume things work like our world, except where they explicitly don't.

I agree with this, but what I consider to be simulationist vs eg 5e tends to be more fiddly than I want, take GURPs for example.

Finding that right balance between too fiddly and too abstract is not easy. I tend to prefer the latter in that case.