Scrying with a Crystal Ball

[LiL KiNG]

Found an odd situation for me and was looking for advice; I'm going to be DM'ing our group and am running them through a dungeon, using the basic idea of the dungeon being a testing ground that a powerful Drow Mystic Theurge will watch their progress through via Crystal Ball - one with Detect Thoughts as well.

Now, I'm not one for magic and spells, I like martial characters - but can appreciate a good spell, or magic items with SLAs. As such I'm not well versed on how the party might be able to detect the scrying with the crystal ball? There are no Sorc/Wiz/Bards in the group to cast Detect Scrying and no one has a magic item with any effects like that.

I'd like to give them a fair chance of knowing they are being scryed upon, if its even possible, but the Crystal ball only give the Will Save DC of 16 to negate scrying and DC 13 to negate the detect thoughts - should I have the party to this periodically or only once? Since the BBG will be knowledgeable of his own dungeon can they even resist the scrying as he could scry the location and not any particular person?

Thanks in advance!

 

[Shin Okada]

From SRD,

Crystal Ball: This is the most common form of scrying device, a crystal sphere about 6 inches in diameter. A character can use the device to see over virtually any distance or into other planes of existence, as with the spell scrying (Will DC 16 negates).

So a Crystal Ball works like Scrying spell. Scrying spell is categolized as Divination (Scrying)

Now, also from SRD,

Scrying: A scrying spell creates an invisible magical sensor that sends you information. Unless noted otherwise, the sensor has the same powers of sensory acuity that you possess. This level of acuity includes any spells or effects that target you, but not spells or effects that emanate from you. However, the sensor is treated as a separate, independent sensory organ of yours, and thus it functions normally even if you have been blinded, deafened, or otherwise suffered sensory impairment.
Any creature with an Intelligence score of 12 or higher can notice the sensor by making a DC 20 Intelligence check. The sensor can be dispelled as if it were an active spell.
Lead sheeting or magical protection blocks a scrying spell, and you sense that the spell is so blocked.

So, any PC with Int 12+ can notice sensor by making a DC 20 Int check.

 

[Hassassin]

I'd also note that:

A creature that successfully saves against a spell that has no obvious physical effects feels a hostile force or a tingle, but cannot deduce the exact nature of the attack.

 

[LiL KiNG]

[MENTION=64564]Shin[/MENTION]: awesome thank you!
[MENTION=6675228]Hassassin[/MENTION]: that is cool, the RP application I can get out of them will be interesting, thanks!

 

[Jack Simth]

I'd also note that:

Don't forget, however, a line from The Spellcraft Skill:

DC 25+Spell Level After rolling a saving throw against a spell targeted on you, determine what that spell was. No action required. No retry.

So it's still identifiable, technically, via Spellcraft. As Scrying is usually a 4th level spell, and the duration on a Crystal Ball is only 1 minute/level (at caster level 10), for an hour-long activation time, there's going to be a rather lot of checks if the BBEG wants to keep pretty close tabs on the party.

Oh yes, and Scrying doesn't permit scrying on locations; just people. For locations, you want a Third Eye Sense.

 

[LiL KiNG]

[MENTION=4078]Jack[/MENTION]: also very good information to note down, thanks much mate!!

 

[RUMBLETiGER]

There is a Prestige class that I'm trying to track down the name and info of, that allows the character to be fully aware of one particular dungeon that this character is the lord and master of. Can anyone recall which PrC this is?

 

[Vegepygmy]

As such I'm not well versed on how the party might be able to detect the scrying with the crystal ball? There are no Sorc/Wiz/Bards in the group to cast Detect Scrying and no one has a magic item with any effects like that.

Keep in mind that things like see invisibility will also reveal the invisible sensor.

 

[LiL KiNG]

[MENTION=40109]Vegepygmy[/MENTION]: gotcha covered, but thank you. Only one guy has a 'see invisibility' magic item, but I'm not sure he'd think to use it if he had no way of sensing something.

actually, on that note, what does this 'sensor' even look like lol - I've been mulling it over as I can't find a description anywhere. Just a floating invisible eyeball or something lol?

 

[Hassassin]

Don't forget, however, a line from The Spellcraft Skill:

So it's still identifiable, technically, via Spellcraft.

Ah, yes. That makes it actually quite likely that a mid-high level spellcaster would notice. However, the Mystic Theurge would probably target a non-spellcaster in any case (due to Will save), unless there's a plot reason otherwise... So unless the first few targets make their saves, spellcraft wouldn't matter.