D&D 5E Question on reading scrolls

[TheSwartz]

I'm reading and re-reading this, and I find pages 139-140 and pages 200-201 in the DMG in regards to scrolls a little confusing

THE FIRST QUESTION is in regards to who can read a spell scroll?

On page 139, it says

"Any creature that can understand a written language can read the arcane script on a scroll and attempt to activate it."

However, on page 200 (in the errata version), it says

“If the spell is on your class’s spell list, you can read the scroll and cast its spell without providing any material components. Otherwise, the scroll is unintelligible."

The page 200 version is stricter; both can't be true. And, I don't see that either of these state they are variant rules.

SECOND QUESTION is in regards to what can go wrong if a spell scroll is not read correctly?

There are the variant rules in DMG page 140 for "Scroll Mishaps" which starts with

"A creature who tries and fails to cast a spell from a spell scroll must make a DC 10 Intelligence saving throw. If the saving throw fails, roll on the Scroll Mishap table."

And then, in the DMG on page 200 under "Spell Scrolls" it states

"If the spell is on your class's spell list but of a higher level than you can normally cast, you must make an ability check using your spellcasting ability to determine whether you cast it successfully. The DC equals 10 + the spell's level. On a failed check, the spell disappears from the scroll with no other effect."

Obviously, I think you just go with the rules on page 200 for a spellcaster trying to cast a spell above their level, UNLESS you want to use the variant rules. So my questions are about using the variant rules, in which case, is this the format?

1. [page 200] perform an ability check with spellcasting ability vs DC of 10 + spell level
2. [page 140] if the above fails, THEN do the DC 10 INT saving throw to see if a mishap occurs?

This sounds cumbersome, though I think it makes sense to give the chance that nothing happens as a result vs a mishap, so this is what I'll do unless someone points out something else?

Thanks!

 

[Enevhar Aldarion]

Because there are two kinds of scrolls. The first kind is the Scroll of Protection in the Magic Items section of the DMG. Those are the kind that anyone can try to activate. The second kind is the spell scroll that has actual spells inscribed onto them. Those are the kind that only those with the spell on their spell list can try to activate.

 

[Shiroiken]

Best to think of them as two different types of scrolls, and write them down differently. Scroll of Protection (type) and Spell Scroll (spell). Anyone can read and use a Scroll of Protection. You must have the spell on your class list to read and use a Spell Scroll.

 

[TheSwartz]

Best to think of them as two different types of scrolls, and write them down differently. Scroll of Protection (type) and Spell Scroll (spell). Anyone can read and use a Scroll of Protection. You must have the spell on your class list to read and use a Spell Scroll.

Because there are two kinds of scrolls. The first kind is the Scroll of Protection in the Magic Items section of the DMG. Those are the kind that anyone can try to activate. The second kind is the spell scroll that has actual spells inscribed onto them. Those are the kind that only those with the spell on their spell list can try to activate.

Ahhhhhhhhhh... OK, I see now. Thanks!

 

[CapnZapp]

This is a huge pet peeve of mine.

Why OH WHY did they add (back) another type of magic item, that has nothing to do with the scrolls everybody expects to contain spells!?

Had scrolls of protection been renamed a synonym to "scroll" there wouldn't have been a problem:
papyrus of protection
parchment of protection
volute of protection
...

 

[Ed Laprade]

Totally agree with CapnZapp. In fact, in my game anyone can (try to) use any kind of scroll if they can read it.

 

[jaelis]

In fact, in my game anyone can (try to) use any kind of scroll if they can read it.

Do you find that steps on the toes of Thief rogues with their use magic device ability?

 

[Ed Laprade]

Do you find that steps on the toes of Thief rogues with their use magic device ability?

No, but the characters haven't found many, so it hasn't come up really.

 

[Enevhar Aldarion]

Totally agree with CapnZapp. In fact, in my game anyone can (try to) use any kind of scroll if they can read it.

Did you also change the system so that spell scrolls are no longer written either fully or partially in a magic-based language? This is part of why the rule for having the spell on your spell list exists. If you do not have any training in the relevant spell-casting type/style and related magic words/phrases/language, then you have no chance to understand it or use it properly. Remember poor Ash from Army of Darkness?

 

[Sword of Spirit]

The general rules (as opposed to the specific rules for spell scrolls) also allow for new types of scrolls that are neither spell scrolls nor protection scrolls.