D&D General Languages suck in D&D.

As someone that is interested in linguistics, especially etymology and how different languages are related to each other, I think that realistically simulating how languages work would be mostly detrimental to the experience of playing a game. Imagine if every every few days the characters are on the road the local dialect became more and more difficult to understand, until you run into a language that isn't mutually intelligible with their language and they have a much harder time interacting with the NPCs. Trying to model regional dialects would make the game worse. There are ways you could alleviate this issue, like having there be a lingua franca that merchants and other travelers use, but most of my adventures involve the PCs talking with many NPCs in an area to learn information. Realistically modeling languages would heavily interfere with how I play the game. In D&D, the Common language is a handwave, similar to babelfish from Hitchhiker's Guide or the translator implants from Guardians of the Galaxy. I think the game would be less fun if it correctly modeled how languages work in the real world.

Baldur's Gate is almost 600 miles from Waterdeep. In a medieval-adjacent setting, that would almost definitely mean that a native Baldurian citizen would not be able to understand a Waterdhavian. Imagine if when you play Gale in Baldur's Gate 3, you couldn't understand any of the characters from Baldur's Gate unless you cast a language spell.

I do think there are settings that have interesting approaches to language, mainly Eberron. In Eberron, the main continent Khorvaire was colonized by humans from Sarlona. The 5 Nations speak Common because it was the official language of Galifar. Riedran is related to Common, they're both descended from "Old Common," but they're not mutually intelligible. Goblin was the language of the Dhakaani Empire, so goblinoids and most other native races to Khorvaire know how to speak it. Elvish, uniquely, is something elves are born with an innate understanding of. In my own games, I do enjoy experimenting with the language system and including stuff like creoles, but I do not have any urge to fundamentally change the language system.

I do not think regional languages would work in a game like D&D, where there is no assumed setting. D&D has to have "Goblin," because the language cannot be called "Dhakaani," or "Maglubiyetan," or "Urshani," as that name would not work in most D&D worlds. I think racial languages kind of have to be the default in D&D. Undercommon and the planar languages work because enough settings have an Underdark and outer planes for them to be in the core rules.

D&D is not a simulation. I do think every setting could use a more Eberronian approach to language, but trying to accurately model how languages work would make the game worse.
 

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I recall a table in 4e that said which languages were written in which scripts; I think we could easily make languages a bit more fun if we arranged them in language families and also by which script they're written in. Maybe if you speak a related language and a language in the same script, you get advantage on deciphering the meaning (which might be an investigation or insight check)?
 

I recall a table in 4e that said which languages were written in which scripts; I think we could easily make languages a bit more fun if we arranged them in language families and also by which script they're written in. Maybe if you speak a related language and a language in the same script, you get advantage on deciphering the meaning (which might be an investigation or insight check)?
2014!5e had something similar, where IIRC some languages like Orcish were based on Dwarvish, which was based on Giant. There was some interesting worldbuilding implications about how far the dwarven holds' influence could reach, having introduced their written language to so many different peoples.

I think Sylvan influenced Elvish script too.
 

I recall a table in 4e that said which languages were written in which scripts; I think we could easily make languages a bit more fun if we arranged them in language families and also by which script they're written in. Maybe if you speak a related language and a language in the same script, you get advantage on deciphering the meaning (which might be an investigation or insight check)?
I do this to an extent in my Greyhawk campaign. My campaign document includes all languages and what's related to what. If you understand a related language, you can get the general gist of what's said.
 

Core D&D has 16 languages. And they all suck except MAYBE one.
Sad by true...

It's one of those things that designers and gamers seem to always think it would be so cool to have, so we  need to put them in the game otherwise they go like "where are the languages, this game doesn't have languages, how can we play without languages?". But then, they don't use them because most players don't find them interesting enough, so why should designers waste worktime and book pages on a better system for something that will be mostly overlooked?
 

I like to lampshade it by imagining that the racial languages are hardcoded by the creator gods and that "common" isn't a single language but a set of pidgins that are mutually intelligible with each other because they're all derived from mashing up the racial languages (which is also why underdark creatures have a distinct common tongue; it's derived from different base languages (although this latter explanation falls apart when you rralize that it implies that dwarves should speak undercommon and not common))

EDIT:
In general I like to imagine that NONE of the base species traits are cultural; That's too mundane. Rather, an elf - for example - can pick up a longsword having never seen one before and wield it like a professional soldier because Corellon hardcoded that ability into them
 
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I posted a very similar thread two years ago, and while I agree with your grievances, I really don't think trying to simulate languages naturally is a good task for most TTRPG groups. People just aren't interested in that kind of language geekery, the amount of worldbuilding it requires is too much for GMs and professional companies alike, and the effect on the actual in the moment gaming is fairly minimal. If you're into designing complex linguistic histories for your world, by all means have fun, but if you're trying to make an RPG with even slightly mass-market appeal, I just don't see complex language rules as something that will interest people.

Like I proposed in my earlier thread, I think the most D&D-like solution would be handwaving all rules related to mortal languages, keeping "outsider" languages like Celestial and Deep Speech as pulp-y plot hooks, and using the gap in proficiencies left from mortal languages with some sort of a social affinity system to better reflect the class-based nature of the world. I've been trying it in my ongoing campaign, and admittedly the players forget they've got social affinity with certain groups sometimes, but when they do remember it, it works well.
 

In my experience the only time a language has been an issue in game has been a DM issue. By that I mean a DM in a game or 2 has had a key part of the game hidden behind a particular language that none of the party spoke. It was awkward, but the DM's were quick thinkers and found work arounds.

I have also played games where things like "thieves cant" were a lot of fun in game and very helpful to the arc.

Languages are only important if you want them to be in D&D.
 

Core D&D has 16 languages. And they all suck except MAYBE one.

That's not to say that it 'sucks' to speak a specific given language or whatever. Or that people speaking Goblin being incapable of communicating with people who don't speak Goblin is somehow unrealistic.

I'm saying that, as a concept, the languages that are provided are terrible and provide an image of cultural monoliths and narrative identity-stripping to a ridiculous degree. Sincerely just awful.

Essentially: Every "Race" gets its own language. And every "Race" that you add gets to speak it's own unique special snowflake language which further dilutes all understanding to being Common and nothing else. Common, as a result, is the language that everything in the entire game gets communicated in, unless the party's elves want to talk trash about the dwarf in the bar without anyone overhearing them.

... which is a valid use of other languages, of course, but the point is most languages are rendered utterly moot.

It also means that every Goblin speaks the same language everywhere in the world. Every Bugbear, Hobgoblin, and Goblin from the Moonshae Isles to the ass-end of Kara Tur speaks Goblin in the exact same way... Though depending on your DM they might speak it with one of several offensive accent caricatures.

Goblins in the Underdark? Goblin. Goblins on the mountaintops? Goblin. Goblins isolated to a fast-time demiplane for 10,000 years with a hyper-evolved society and space-fantasy technology? Goblin.

Meanwhile, in the -REAL WORLD-, people on the "Wrong Side" of the Alps spoke such a different language the Romans called them barbarians to insult the mealy-mouthed pronunciation of their 'Bar Bar Bar Bar' language.

Hell, even the countries conquered by Rome, that once all spoke Latin because it was -THE- language to speak, now mostly speak new languages that are still based -on- Latin... But don't make sense to each other. Don't believe me? Go to Spain and speak Italian, exclusively, while telling everyone you're speaking the Roman tongue and they should understand you!

Okay, don't do that. But you know what I mean. Even though French, Italian, Portuguese, Romanian, and Spanish are all "Romance Languages" based on Latin they've all evolved in very different ways due to native cultural languages, neighboring languages, and conquests.

And it's not like Pathfinder is -much- different in that regard. Oh, sure, they add a ton of different human languages to go along with 'Common'... But then they keep all the other Race languages and add in some fresh ones like Vanaran and Sahaugin and Rougarou and...

Like come the hell on, Golarion, you -almost- had it and then you biffed the landing!

So what's the one maybe good language? Undercommon. Because even though it, like common, is an insane trade language, it almost makes sense because it is, itself, a regional language. The region is Underdark.

Regional languages make infinitely more sense for a story purpose. If you absolutely HAVE to have at least ONE racial language, make it Elven to show they're a united people for all their disparities... united in being old and unwilling to adapt their language based on the cultures and languages around themselves.

But imagine a setting where there are, maybe, 6 languages to choose from for the area you're in. Your character's heritage as an elf or a halfling doesn't really play into which of those 6 you know, but one is the most common, like English in England, but there's still Gaelic, Scots, and Welsh about, the nobles speak French, and the Germans are a potential threat. Way easier to pick languages that make sense for your character in relation to the setting, and even if there's only a handful of pieces of German in the entire game it'll still be more useful than freaking Rougarou...

Corollary: Thieves Cant is trash. It's meant to simulate Cockney rhyming slang being used to confuse cops and stuff, but adding in a universal "Thief" language doesn't make any more sense when your thieves from opposite ends of the world can communicate without any issue.

TLDR
Racial languages, which D&D runs on as a foundational principle, suck. Regional Languages are way better.
You are of course right.

The Forgotten Realms has taken this approach with regional languages and even added them
Into some of adventures set in the FR.

Common regional languages include
  • Illuskan
  • Chondathan
  • Damaran
  • Rashemi
Interestingly these also have their ancient root equivalents which can be understood by several languages. So Thorass the general equivalent of Latin and forms the basis of Chondathan but also Jhaamdathan and Common.

Regarding Common, I have travelled a fair old bit, and I am continually amazed how many people (in leisure and retail at least) are able to speak English. It isn’t as widespread as you get out into the Styx but it’s rare not to be able to easily find someone who speaks it.

I’d like to see languages used more in RPGs but that requires a detailed gameworld and a fair amount of internal consistency..
 

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