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It finally happened...

Cor Azer

First Post
Fourteen years of gaming, thirteen and half of which have been spent DMing various groups, and I've finally had the first unfortunate need to warn a player he's risking being kicked out of my group.

I stated well before the start of the campaign, set in the Realms, that it was going to be heroic (I was even frowning on neutral characters, although I did allow one or two because of good backgrounds). He missed the first week because he didn't feel like playing, and then got angry at the rest of us for still playing. "Your problem," I told him.

Last night, the party was tracking a cleric of Malar who had used a Jade Statue to cast a powerful spell, a magical plague the reverted victims to a very primal state, and by the end of the adventure it had affected a large number (in the thousands) of humans and a few other demi-humans, even one of the PCs had fallen victim to it. They discovered early on that they had to
shatter the Statue to end the spell, and that this was the only way to end it.

At one point, this player, playing a gold elven wizard/rogue, had his character send a letter to a nearby (well, the closest, it's actually two
weeks away by foot) elven community, citing that an army should come in to kill everyone so that the plague wouldn't spread (he had nothing but his own hypothesis about the spreading, but I can't fault him that).

When finally the characters were able to take down the cleric of Malar (which, I must admit, was one of the most interesting battles I've gotten to
run for any of my players in a long tme), the characters retrieved the Statue, and then debated destroying it or not. One of the PCs (half wild elven barbarian/ranger - the one was had been affected) needs to return it to his village so his exile will be ended, but most wanted to destroy it to end the spell's effects. Eventually, a wild elven druid arrives and says that the Statue should be destroyed. In short, I was expecting a debate, but not such a lengthy one, and I figured - this being a heroic campaign - that the players
would do the 'right' thing and end the evil spell.

The problem player's character has since said to me that he will attack anyone who tries to destroy the Statue, because he thinks it could be used as
a weapon against the enemies of elves - specifically, devolving humans and orcs to such a state that they'd kill themselves off.

I told him that such an action is not heroic, not even from an elven view point, and while possibly heavy-handed, I told him if he insists on running
his character in such a way, I'd be forced to kick him (well the character, but I'm sure the player would stop coming if I did such a thing to his
character) from the group.

You can take this as you will, since I know I may not be presenting his side of the story fairly. I'm not really asking for other opinions on this,
although they are welcome. Mainly, I just thought I'd vent my frustrations over a player not following my expectations for the campaign.

Thanks for reading...
 

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Wicht

Hero
Instead of kicking him out, why not have his actions make him a temporary pariah, even amongst his own elven kind. Perhaps he will repent or perhaps he will end up doing something that gets him killed. But I would let the choice be his and the consequences be sever but then if he quits it is his choice and you will not have been accused of being heavy handed.
 

eXodus

Explorer
you may not need to kick him out of the game.

that may well be a little on the extreme side. i am sure there are ways through roleplaying and the like to show the character that his thoughts on the jade statue are over the top.

i would have the statue start to dominate him. make it stat to influence the wayward elf. he would learn really quick that he idea to save the statue is not a good one.

let the cards fall where they will.
 

Cor Azer

First Post
Wicht said:
Instead of kicking him out, why not have his actions make him a temporary pariah, even amongst his own elven kind. Perhaps he will repent or perhaps he will end up doing something that gets him killed. But I would let the choice be his and the consequences be sever but then if he quits it is his choice and you will not have been accused of being heavy handed.

While I would try that in a longer running campaign, this one is probably only going to run for a few months (at which point I'm planning on finishing my graduate studies and probably end up leaving the area). I already have the adventures more-or-less planned out and I don't want to waste a lot of time trying to reconcile an elven pariah into them. Besides, if he took the suicidal option, he might very well end up taking the party with him, which also undermines the campaign.

Plus, the player has been a problem in other games, which, while I wasn't always privy to his actions, some of the other players in my current game have and have lodged complaints with me.

I am giving him a chance to repent, so to speak, hence the warning. If his character doesn't become more heroic (I'm not asking him to sacrifice himself to save anyone, I'm just saying that genocide isn't heroic), then the character is gone. And like I said, the player has a tendency to sulk, so he'd probably quit playing.
 

Rune

Once A Fool
A tough call, but ultimately a good one. You set the parmameters up at the beginning, and it is unfair to you, unfair to your players, and also unfair to the problem player to allow him to continue to play in a game that has a style contrary to his own.

Good luck and congratulations on making through so many years without having to face this situation before!
 

Axiomatic Unicorn

First Post
Always a tough problem.
On the one hand it can be hard to justify playing if someone is going to ruin it.
On the other hand, it is often hard to antagonize someone over "just a game".

But in this case, if you expect to be leaving anyway, it seems to make much more sense to go on without this one person.

You can always try to be polite, but somehow that never seems to really work out.

Good Luck
 

Mark

CreativeMountainGames.com
DM: OK. If you are sure that is the only way that this character would act, I guess that's the way it is, but I'm surprised that you would want to no longer play him. Your choice, of course...

Player: Huh?

DM: Well, as I said at the beginning, I am running a game where the player's characters have to be heroes and you are insisting that this one is going to not be heroic, but rather take a stance of selfishness and greed. Now, I undestand if you feel you've role-played him into a box and he needs to become an NPC, but I really think you could choose a heroic path for him if you reconsidered.

Player: But, it's what I think he would do...

DM: Very well. Hand him over to me, though there is no going back, and I'll run him from now on. What will your new character be like as a hero? Hopefully a little less inflexible...?

Player: Erm...
 
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Artoomis

First Post
Mark said:
DM: OK. If you are sure that is the only way that this character would act, I guess that's the way it is, but I'm surprised that you would want to no longer play him. Your choice, of course...

Player: Huh?

DM: Well, as I said at the beginning, I am running a game where the player's characters have to be heroes and you are insisting that this one is going to not be heroic, but rather take a stance of selfishness and greed. Now, I undestand if you feel you've role-played him into a box and he needs to become an NPC, but I really think you could choose a heroic path for him if you reconsidered.

Player: But, it's what I think he would do...

DM: Very well. Hand him over to me, though there is no going back, and I'll run him from now on. What will your new character be like as a hero? Hopefully a little less inflexible...?

Player: Erm...

Very Nice.
 

Kichwas

Half-breed, still living despite WotC racism
Wicht said:
Instead of kicking him out, why not have his actions make him a temporary pariah, even amongst his own elven kind.

The only problem I'd see with this is that the DM has made it clear he wants a heroic game. And going down this road would in effect be running a villains game.
 

thundershot

Adventurer
Well... in my group, I try to make sure people stick to their alignments. However, I also make it clear that the characters can do anything that they want, AS LONG AS THEY ARE WILLING TO DEAL WITH THE CONSEQUENCES. Sometimes it makes a planned adventure turn out differently, but it's better than them feeling like it's a set plot...


Chris
 

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