Wild Shape and Weight

[SelcSilverhand]

A situation came up in my game last night that I could use some help on. The question is this: Does a druids weight change when he wild shapes?


Our party came to a rope bridge designed to support the weight of a few small sized humanoids and collapse if a certain number of medium sized humanoids crossed the bridge. One of my players, a druid, wanted to wildshape into a dog and cross the bridge with the others. His argument was that he would weigh less as a dog. He carries a lot of weight in gear and full plate dragonhide armor in humanoid form. I told him that his weight would not change since the SRD says: Any gear worn or carried by the druid melds into the new form and becomes nonfunctional. I said the gear doesn't disappear into an extra dimensional space like in a bag of holding. As a follow-up to this argument I asked him if he thinks his encumbrance would change when he shifted. Do you think a druid carrying a 500lb rock in his backpack would go from medium encumbrance to light when he shapeshifts and the backpack merges with his new body? We decided to proceed as if his weight would still be higher than an average dog with all the gear that melded into his new body. Is there a rule I missed somewhere that would counter this argument?

It ended up not being an issue in game. Halfway across the bridge he returned to humanoid form. Also on the bridge was his cleric buddy. The second cleric player was retreating from an attack at the other end of the bridge and put them over the critical weight limit

 

[darthkilmor]

I'd go with the text of Reduce Person:

This spell causes instant diminution of a humanoid creature, halving its height, length, and width and dividing its weight by 8. This decrease changes the creature’s size category to the next smaller one. The target gains a +2 size bonus to Dexterity, a -2 size penalty to Strength (to a minimum of 1), and a +1 bonus on attack rolls and AC due to its reduced size.

A Small humanoid creature whose size decreases to Tiny has a space of 2½ feet and a natural reach of 0 feet (meaning that it must enter an opponent’s square to attack). A Large humanoid creature whose size decreases to Medium has a space of 5 feet and a natural reach of 5 feet. This spell doesn’t change the target’s speed.

All equipment worn or carried by a creature is similarly reduced by the spell.

 

[frankthedm]

I'd go with the text of Reduce Person:

The equipment chapter generally halves weight of gear for small and doubles for large.

 

[IamTheTest]

Wonder why he wouldnt become a creature that can fly...

 

[darthkilmor]

The equipment chapter generally halves weight of gear for small and doubles for large.

Hmm, Interesting Discrepancy...

 

[Infiniti2000]

Hmm, Interesting Discrepancy...

It's due to a difference in mechanics based on how much a creature weighs (rarely relevant) and how much he can carry. The strength penalty for smaller size is only -2, so compare that to the equipment weight dividing by 2 and by 8. These rules most likely do not have any realism basis besides the fact of going down/up.

 

[sukael]

I'd rule, personally, that he has the weight of an average member of the species he's turned into (just like other stats).

Ruling that he somehow keeps the weight of all his equipment has some pretty nasty effects on turning into a flying creature, or anything at all particularly small or with a low Str score.

 

[SelcSilverhand]

Thanks for the replies. The flying creature problem pokes some holes in my argument. Reduce person divides the creatures weight by 8, and if you apply the same rules to the gear (size, length, width all halved, and weight divided) this removes encumbrance almost entirely. If you had a 10str your medium encumbrance range is 34-66lbs. If you were carrying 66lbs of gear and were then reduced, you would have an 8str, a medium encumbrance of 20.25-39.75lbs (reduced to 3/4's for small), and your gear now only weighs 8.25lbs when divided by 8.

If you use the rules for gear weighing half as much for small characters when you get reduced, you end up with 33lbs of equipment, keeping you in the medium encumbrance range. This makes the most sense to me.

Wonder why he wouldnt become a creature that can fly...

We were using the PB2 druid variant and he only had the predator form available.

 

[mikebr99]

I'd rule, personally, that he has the weight of an average member of the species he's turned into (just like other stats).

Ruling that he somehow keeps the weight of all his equipment has some pretty nasty effects on turning into a flying creature, or anything at all particularly small or with a low Str score.

African, or European swallow?

Mike