D&D General Who “owns” a PC after the player stops using them?

[Ondath]

Actually, you cant create a Darth Vader character without permission. I assume Disney has some kind of fandom policy, which gives you permission, but you would need to know its details.


Actually, if you do it wrong, and without permission, Disney has the prerogative to sue you.

Absolute poppycock. I can place and use whichever copyrighted character I want in my non-commercial home game, and Disney can do nothing about it. We're talking about campaigns and DMing here, of course commercial products are different. But for home games, nothing can legally and morally stop me from adding whatever IP I want.

 

[Yaarel]

@Yaarel furthermore, I gave the example of Mordenkainen for a specific reason: He has a current canon status in official D&D (like I said, mad and amnesiac in a certain D&D adventure). If I gloss over that canon plot point entirely and say he has never had such an affliction and never will, am I slighting WotC in any way?

If I am not, what is the difference between that and putting a friend's PC in my campaign world as an NPC in a way the friend didn't expressly allow? If it's my campaign world (separate from the canon of where the friend plays that character), how is that character becoming an NPC a slight to my friend?

D&D has rules, that are part of the game.

The DM employing an official NPC − whether Mordenkainen or Drizzt or whoever − is part of the rules of the game. You have PERMISSION to do this.

 

[Yaarel]

I want in my non-commercial home game, and Disney can do nothing about it.

I dont know why people say this. They should talk to their IP lawyer and understand the details of why they are wrong.

 

[Ondath]

D&D has rules, that are part of the game.

The DM employing an official NPC − whether Mordenkainen or Drizzt or whoever − is part of the rules of the game. You have PERMISSION to do this.

So are D&D 5e home games that use IPs that aren't officially adapted to the 5e ruleset (Star Wars, Avatar: the Last Airbender, Marvel Comics, etc.) illegal?!

I mean, you realise how ridiculous that sounds, right?

I dont know why people say this. They should talk to their IP lawyer and understand the details of why they are wrong.

I can tell you why they're saying this: Copyright protects commercial use and no company was mad enough to try and sue people when they scribbled Spider-Man on their drawing practice notebook. People can and do use IPs for their homegames without permission from that IP all the time, and the idea that IP law would somehow extend into people's private creations is just as ridiculous as it is unenforceable.

 

[TwoSix]

I can tell you why they're saying this: Copyright protects commercial use and no company was mad enough to try and sue people when they scribbled Spider-Man on their drawing practice notebook. People can and do use IPs for their homegames without permission from that IP all the time, and the idea that IP law would somehow extend into people's private creations is just as ridiculous as it is unenforceable.

And even it were somehow illegal, it would be both unenforceable and unethical.

Talking about legality really just distracts from the topic. The point is what courtesies do we owe to each other as part of the social contract of play.

I will reiterate my stance. Once you leave a game for an extended period, you no longer have any standing to dispute any action that occurs in that game. The fact that you created a particular character has no bearing. Even in a game with heavier player authorship than baseline D&D, you don't have any say over an NPC or country or magic item you added to the game. The game space is entirely the property of the current participants.

 

[Yaarel]

So are D&D 5e home games that use IPs that aren't officially adapted to the 5e ruleset (Star Wars, Avatar: the Last Airbender, Marvel Comics, etc.) illegal?!

I mean, you realise how ridiculous that sounds, right?

You seem unaware of the laws. Or events.

For example, people create fandom settings for D&D, such as from the IP of videogames. These fans can and sometimes do get legal cease-and-desists.

I can tell you why they're saying this: Copyright protects commercial use and no company was mad enough to try and sue people when they scribbled Spider-Man on their drawing practice notebook.

I agree, it is in the self-interest of an authorship to welcome fans and fandom. At the same, the authorship never loses ownership of their creations.

People can and do use IPs for their homegames without permission from that IP all the time, and the idea that IP law would somehow extend into people's private creations is just as ridiculous as it is unenforceable.

Fans do use IP content. For example, WotC has a fandom policy, a legal contract, which gives fans permission to use certain WotC content if careful to avoid disrespectful usage or other offensive usage.

 

[Schmoe]

I dont know why people say this. They should talk to their IP lawyer and understand the details of why they are wrong.

Sorry, but I don't think so. Use of an IP in a private game of D&D would almost certainly fall under Fair Use. If you have a counter example I'd love to hear it. Saying that people aren't able to tell each other stories about IP is ridiculous. Should I ask Marvel before I tell my son a Spiderman bedtime story?

 

[billd91]

For example, people create fandom settings for D&D, such as from videogames. These fans can and sometimes do get legal cease-and-desists.

They do when they distribute them in some way such as on the internet. Without doing that, there's little likelihood of the IP holder ever being aware of the setting.

 

[Yaarel]

Sorry, but I don't think so. Use of an IP in a private game of D&D would almost certainly fall under Fair Use. If you have a counter example I'd love to hear it. Saying that people aren't able to tell each other stories about IP is ridiculous. Should I ask Marvel before I tell my son a Spiderman bedtime story?

I assume Marvel has a fan policy, a legal contract, that allows you tell bedtime stories about Spiderman.

 

[Maxperson]

WotC owns the Mordenkainen IP. WotC paid money to buy and own various products from Gygax via TSR. Mordenkainen is an official 5e NPC. As part of the rules of the game we have legal PERMISSION from WotC to use this character in the same way as any other official monster statblock. I dont think there is an official statblock for him, but he is known inworld and a DM can easily write up a statblock for him.

Because of the IP, we cant independently sell a product with Mordenkainen. But we can use the DMsGuild and its legal contract to sell a product that includes Mordenkainen.

Mordenkainen the Wizard was given stats in 1e in Mordenkainen's Fantastic Adventure. He was a M-U 12, AC 1, Move 12", HP: 52, 2 attacks with a dagger, alignment: N, S:10, I:18, W:15, D:17, C:17, CH:18