D&D General When to know a rule?

[bloodtide]

Now, the OP mentions having a bunch of themed spells (like cold spells), and I would hope that if a PC has a cold-theme such as a Silver Dragonborn Sorcerer or something, the DM would allow that player to view these cold-themed spells for that PC.

Of course, that is half the point. If a player wants it, they get a handout of Common Cold Spells. And maybe a couple common spells from their race, background and homeland. But they will never get a handout of "all the cold spells".

That's cool, but that's you. This DM has many of these spells (presumably) to give the players "new magic" to encounter during gameplay. It adds to the mystery and wonder and I understand that. Especially spells which come from species or regions foreign to the PCs.

The vast majority of my games are the exotic adventure type....as that is the sort of game I like. Having the PCs head off into the unknown is much more fun! Seven miles underground the drow foe has shadow bolt and acid strike...not the PH spells.

. And if a DM were to have access to a thousand pages of homebrew spells, I doubt that they would do as you just mentioned. That's a good way of losing your players to another table and harming your own rep as a DM. You want the players to trust your skills as a DM.

The players I mention are players: they complain but still play in my game. The spells is not enough to make them walk out of the game.

Not that I don't have plenty of houserules that do that....

Hey there's a reason I keep all my old books around. Sure, a lot of what was written in the 2e era was "throw stuff at the wall and see what sells", but for all it's flaws, there were a lot of really great ideas that came out of that halcyon era.

Convert all the 2E spells into 5E? Hummm, who would have thought of that.....

 

[James Gasik]

Of course, that is half the point. If a player wants it, they get a handout of Common Cold Spells. And maybe a couple common spells from their race, background and homeland. But they will never get a handout of "all the cold spells".

The vast majority of my games are the exotic adventure type....as that is the sort of game I like. Having the PCs head off into the unknown is much more fun! Seven miles underground the drow foe has shadow bolt and acid strike...not the PH spells.


The players I mention are players: they complain but still play in my game. The spells is not enough to make them walk out of the game.

Not that I don't have plenty of houserules that do that....


Convert all the 2E spells into 5E? Hummm, who would have thought of that.....

I wouldn't attempt such a thing myself, that's a lot of spells, and most are pretty niche. Which is a problem with a lot of third party spells to begin with- much of Deep Magic is composed of "well if I found myself in this specific situation, sure, but..."

 

[CandyLaser]

Other then I do have an amazing grasp of the English language, I also own a wondrous device known as a "computer". This device can read my work and correct things...really it is amazing. I do also possess the skills of: Editing, Proofreading, and Double Checking.

Writing is only "challenging" if your not a writer. Just like anything else. If you have skill and talent, things you know are not "so hard". I doubt you would find many, but sure I make one from time to time. For example I misspell "disintegrate" from time to time.


I'm not really sure what a problem might be? Any spell that needs it, has a good paragraph of Legalese written by me.

Yea...and professionals and multi million dollar game companies that can't seem to hire one editor.....well, you can see their work for yourself.

But there is a huge different between someone doing a job, and someone doing something for fun or love. I, like most gamers, could never make half the mistakes you see in official books. I will never, ever "miss" something like: Detect Magic: school Evocation. Ever.

Of course, also as just a single person who is my own boss, I don't have to listen to others, blinding hand my work off to others, "work" within a corporate juggernaut and get over ruled by random people. If I see a typo, I can stop and fix it in seconds. In a company setting often you can only send an e-mail to your "boss" and hope they take care of it. And...well, there are lots more bad work horror stories.


Yet another reason why players should not know all the spells.

Really not sure if you should be tooting your own horn quite so loudly w/r/t your grasp of the language and the lack of mistakes, given the quality on display here. I invite you to consider that there is a reason why most professional writers have editors and proofreaders, even if they are themselves skilled at those trades.

According to this blog post there are 2,174 wizard spells in the four-volume 2e Wizard's Spell Compendium; it doesn't include every wizard spell in AD&D, but it's close. I found a Reddit post that says there are 1,795 in the three-volume Priest's Spell Compendium. Assuming those figures are accurate, that's 3,969 spells across 2,016 pages. It's not impossible that one person, working alone, has produced more spells than were printed across 20+ years of books, magazines, and boxed sets. It is, however, entirely unbelievable that they would be issue-free.

EDIT: I'm making the assumption here that the bulk of those spells are more than mere palette swaps of existing spells. Bulking up a spell list by including hundreds of entries that are just variations on "Burning hands but it deals acid damage" is trivial, and I wouldn't boast about having added thousands of spells to my game if that's what I'd done.

 

[ezo]

Nope.

When I gain a level in a casting class, I automatically gain new spells known. No research. No cost. They either just poof into my brain, my patron teaches them to me, they get written somehow into my spell book, or, if I'm a divine caster, I know all of them from the get go.

So, if there are 500 new spells in the game world, any divine spells would be known by all divine casters. And, any arcane caster could add them to their spells known automatically.

You gain a new spell from those available to you. If the DM chooses to allow you to create your own spells at the time, sure, it is "free" and "no research"--- when in reality, we know it isn't. The assumption is during your "off-time" (part of short and/or long rests or downtime) you are spending time figuring stuff out, praying for guidance, taking long walks in nature, or whatever to cultivate your learning so when you level you have another spell known or gain access to new level of spells.

So, they don't really just "poof" into your brain. It's just handled off-screen so to say.

Now, you can do it your way, I suppose... But, well, I guess then you would just have to wave it away completely and say, "oh, it's magic!"

You do see where my problem with this is, right?

What problem? You aren't play in their game... so you should be good.

I'm kinda baffled how this is even a discussion?

Because you're sort of conflating "new spells gained when you level" with "new spells that are actually new to the game."

Why wouldn’t we all have equal access to the rules of that game?

You do have eqaul access to the rules, just not the homebrew. Those are very different things.

 

[Lanefan]

Again, let’s stick to 5e please.

There is zero cost and zero time required to create a new spell.

What?

Like that's not broken at all.

DM: "What do you do next?"
Player: "I cast the WeWinEverything spell that I created last week, and with the world forever saved we retire into the sunset."

facepalm

 

[Lanefan]

Based on the PHB? It does say, right there, in black and white, when I gain a level, I gain spells known. Wizards automatically get two new spells in their spell book. There's no "quid pro quo" there's no const. There's nothing. I get whatever level appropriate spell my little heart wants.

From the list of spells as it currently exists.

I'm talking about inventing a new spell from scratch, that's not already on the list; such as (from our own games) Pagey's Pages, Tse's Transformational Triage, Lesilkasig Uubo's Fancy Filing*, and so forth. Are you saying that in 5e there's neither cost nor time required to do so?

* - Pagey's Pages: an illusionist spell that functions as a photocopier using "ink" that fades in about a month
Tse's Transformations Triage: a mage spell that gives the caster very limited healing ability vs actual physical injury
Lesilkasig Uubo's Fancy Filing: a mage spell that allows reordering of spells on a scroll or in a spellbook.

Fancy Filing is brand new as of three weeks ago.

I'm kinda baffled how this is even a discussion? Do casters in your game not get access to new spells when they level up?

Only from those already in the PH and-or whatever other sourcebooks are in use.

 

[James Gasik]

What?

Like that's not broken at all.

DM: "What do you do next?"
Player: "I cast the WeWinEverything spell that I created last week, and with the world forever saved we retire into the sunset."

facepalm

Well, while there may not be a default time or cost to work with for spell creation, there are two other considerations. One, the spell creation guidelines (we know WotC breaks their own rules here, buffing damage and nerfing healing, but that's a whole other conversation) and of course, what the DM will allow. Just like any other option, what you have access to is decided before play begins, with the DM having a pretty strong say. Asking for a spell all your own is right up there (IMO) with asking "Hey can I play a Bloodhunter or a Gunslinger?".

So most likely, the only way you'd get a WeWinEverything spell is if your DM is asleep at the wheel, lol.

Besides, we already have ways to win D&D with stuff WotC published, like Wish/Simulacrum "Snow Cone Wish Factories", 18th level Wizards using Spell Mastery on Silvery Barbs and using Shapechange to become a Marilith to gain a free reaction on each turn (!), using Wall of Stone and Fabricate to build massive fortifications in days, or using Teleport Circle to upend world trade, among other things.

 

[mamba]

According to this blog post there are 2,174 wizard spells in the four-volume 2e Wizard's Spell Compendium; it doesn't include every wizard spell in AD&D, but it's close. I found a Reddit post that says there are 1,795 in the three-volume Priest's Spell Compendium. Assuming those figures are accurate, that's 3,969 spells across 2,016 pages. It's not impossible that one person, working alone, has produced more spells than were printed across 20+ years of books, magazines, and boxed sets. It is, however, entirely unbelievable that they would be issue-free.

pretty sure most of them come from such sources rather than being own inventions, still leaves the 5e conversion for some of them…

 

[mamba]

DM: "What do you do next?"
Player: "I cast the WeWinEverything spell that I created last week, and with the world forever saved we retire into the sunset."

so Wish then?

 

[TwoSix]

Oh boy, an argument about whether or not the DM should have control over the setting or that the players should also have setting definition privileges. This should be novel and interesting.