D&D 5E The Magical Martial

[Chaosmancer]

My argument was basically in agreement DM should be handing out spells as treasure.

Yeah, I like giving out spells to wizards as treasure. And there are a handful of very powerful spells that I limit access to (Wish, clone, simulacrum, that sort of stuff)

 

[Crimson Longinus]

Yeah, I like giving out spells to wizards as treasure. And there are a handful of very powerful spells that I limit access to (Wish, clone, simulacrum, that sort of stuff)

I feel the wizard spells should be divided to common (which you can learn as you level) and rare (which you need to find as a treasure.)

 

[Micah Sweet]

Has the wizard not put in effort to survive and level up? It sounds like forcing them to jump through a hoop, "We know you survived, gathered XP, and leveled up and if you were like everyone else you would just get your abilities. Instead, so you can feel like you really accomplished something, your rewards are randomized, and if you don't get something you want, you can beg and plead to have the opportunity to spend even more time and resources to get that"

Again, hard disagree. You want to randomize spells gained? You have dice. Knock yourself out and randomly roll all your spells.

Seems like another either/or scenario for you. You and I are I think just too different in what we want out of gaming. I've described several methods of compromise in this thread, but if your way insists upon getting to choose multiple specific superpowers from a vast list at every level up, presumably so you can have your perfectly curated character just the way you want them with no regard for the setting or what the PCs are actually doing, then we're just never going to agree.

On the other hand, if I've mischaracterized you, please feel free to correct me on what you actually want or don't want.

 

[Micah Sweet]

I feel the wizard spells should be divided to common (which you can learn as you level) and rare (which you need to find as a treasure.)

I like that too. A nice way to control access logically while still letting the player choose (albeit from a shorter list).

 

[Gammadoodler]

I feel the wizard spells should be divided to common (which you can learn as you level) and rare (which you need to find as a treasure.)

Yeah. As long as it's clear to the DM and players that the DM can add or remove spells from the respective categories at their discretion.

Edit: stuff that gets coded as 'rare' in player-facing literature often starts to stride into some weird worldbuilding issues.

 

[nevin]

deleted responded to wrong post.

 

[nevin]

Yeah. As long as it's clear to the DM and players that the DM can add or remove spells from the respective categories at their discretion.

Edit: stuff that gets coded as 'rare' in player-facing literature often starts to stride into some weird worldbuilding issues.

I like making spells like wish or clone, require mythical components.

 

[Chaosmancer]

I like making spells like wish or clone, require mythical components.

Ooh, that's a cool idea

 

[Chaosmancer]

Seems like another either/or scenario for you. You and I are I think just too different in what we want out of gaming. I've described several methods of compromise in this thread, but if your way insists upon getting to choose multiple specific superpowers from a vast list at every level up, presumably so you can have your perfectly curated character just the way you want them with no regard for the setting or what the PCs are actually doing, then we're just never going to agree.

On the other hand, if I've mischaracterized you, please feel free to correct me on what you actually want or don't want.

Wow. Wanna poison the well a bit harder? I can still feel my eyeballs after reading this. I'm sure you can fix that with some cyanide.

Out of nowhere, you suddenly started saying that wizards should gain random spells. This would not apply to bards, clerics, paladins, druids, sorcerers, warlocks, arcane Tricksters, Eldrtich Knights, Rangers or Artificers. I know this would not apply to them, because one of your compromises has continuously been the acquisition of spells through treasure, and no other class can do this. So, you want to randomize wizards... just because you think it would be more fun if they had to put more effort into gaining their spells than literally everyone else.

No regard to setting? What setting? You have not said this is for setting purposes, you want this for every single wizard. Regardless of setting. Why even bring up "with no regard to the setting" except to poison the well of response?

With no regard to what the PC is doing? Do you mean that you think it somehow makes more sense for someone who is specializing in fire spells to suddenly learn Leomund's Tiny Hut or Spirit Shroud? Somehow, I'm not convinced random die rolls will somehow lead to more coherent narratives of what the PCs are doing. My evidence of this? Multiple games that I've played with random character and event generation that lead to utterly bizarre and nonsensical results.

A "perfectly curated character"? Well, I currently don't randomize race, class, subclass, background, equipment, feats... is that somehow different than not randomizing spells? Am I somehow doing something wrong by choosing options instead of randomizing them?

As for "multiple specific superpowers from a vast list"... yeah, welcome to spellcasting. Glad you could join us. What I WANT in regards to this sudden tangent of randomizing wizard spells is to keep the game like it currently is, because getting to pick two spells per level isn't a problem that I have ever had. If you don't like that, feel free to randomize your spells to your hearts content. But I see no value in doing so for other players or the game as a whole.

 

[W'rkncacnter]

I can still feel my eyeballs after reading this. I'm sure you can fix that with some cyanide.