symbionys and grafts

[gwyllgi]

okay i want to know if it is possible to upgrade symbionts and grafts,

would this take a whole class or a skill.

i want to know because i want something that can get better.

would templates, class levels, or adding new abilities be possible?

 

[gwyllgi]

any one?

 

[Dandu]

Offhand... no?

 

[jefgorbach]

Magic of Eberron states “If a symbiont is grafted onto a visible part of the host creature's body, opponents can attack the symbiont itself instead of its host creature.” so presumably such symbionts could be buffed/enchanted separately from the host as well.

Likewise grafts are created in the same fashion as other wondrous items, so upgrading one simply involves removing the graft from their host (inflicting suitable damage) for further enchanting/upgrading then reinstalling them.

 

[RUMBLETiGER]

hm... great question! Lets consider templates for a moment, applied to symbionts.

Symbionts don't really have a specific creature [type], other than symbiont (well, if I recall, some might be aberrations, some fiends, but I could be remembering wrong). But we can assume they are atleast living, corporeal creatures. So, which templates apply to living, corporeal creatures? Other requirements will be listed:

-Half Elemental templates from Manual of the Planes, Req. Int of 4+.
-Half Celestial template from Monster Manual, Req. Int 4+, non-Evil alignment.
-Half Fiend template from Monster Manual, Req Int 4+, non-Good alignment.
-Draconic template from Races of the Dragon
-Half-Dragon template from Monster Manual and Races of the Dragon
-Half-Fay template from Fiend Folio
-Shadow Creature template from Manual of the Planes
-Psudonatural Creature template from Manual of the Planes
-Revived Fossil template from Libris Mortis, Req. a skeletal system
-Skeleton template from Monster Manual, Req. a skeletal system
-Zombie template from Monster Manual, Req. a skeletal system
-Dustform template from Sandstorm
-Chameleon template from Underdark
-Faerzress-Infused template from Underdark
-Mineral Warrior template from Underdark
-Phantom templates from Monster Manual V
-Ice Beast template from Frostburn
-Lolth-Touched template from Monster Manual IV, Req. non-Good, non-Lawful alignment
-Saint template from Book of Exalted Deeds, Req. Good alignment
-Sanctified template from Book of Exalted Deeds, Req. Evil alignment

This list doesn't include templates from magazines, nor does it consider templates that can be applied to undead, after a corporeal creature is made undead by one of the abouve listed templates that grants undead-ness.

Now... how to actually apply these templates? Magic? Selective Breeding? A very old Fleshwarper NPC who's devoted his life to tinkering with such things? Dunno, good luck.

Hope this helps!

 

[RUMBLETiGER]

Here's a question, can anything with intellegence take class levels? Humanoids can, Monstrous Humanoids, Aberrarions, Dragons, Outsiders, Elementals, Living Constructs, etc. can all take class levels.

Is it too much of a stretch to say a symbiont with an Int of 3+ could choose to take class levels in something?

 

[marcielle]

In Eberron setting taking twisted things and making them MORE twisted is the Daelkyrs whole thing. If you could get a Daelkyr half blood to hijack some of their arcanotech, it is THEORETICALLY possible to give a graft any ability you want(actually rather than advancing you are warping the graft into a more useful form). This requires a LOT of working with your DM and stuff specific for Eberron setting. Then again, its new form might not even be a suitable graft.

Symbionts with high Int and Egos MIGHT be allowed to use class levels like rum said but down this road lies the realm of limberger and swiss. You are basically getting most of the benefit of LEADERSHIP for as low as 2000 gp. Also, DM would probably rule that it comes out of your OWN xp.

As a side note, you gain benefits if you have more than 1 elemental grafts.

 

[jefgorbach]

Symbionts with high Int and Egos MIGHT be allowed to use class levels like rum said but down this road lies the realm of limberger and swiss. You are basically getting most of the benefit of LEADERSHIP for as low as 2000 gp.

The other thing to consider is you're opening numerous plot elements to your (un)friendly DM since, like other intelligent magical items, there's no guarantee the symbiont will share your own moral outlook nor viewpoint of current events -- potentially triggering it to subtly influence your actions, if not outright overwhelm your ego; and Remove Curse would/should prove ineffective at releasing you from its evil clutches.

 

[marcielle]

The other thing to consider is you're opening numerous plot elements to your (un)friendly DM since, like other intelligent magical items, there's no guarantee the symbiont will share your own moral outlook nor viewpoint of current events -- potentially triggering it to subtly influence your actions, if not outright overwhelm your ego; and Remove Curse would/should prove ineffective at releasing you from its evil clutches.

If both of them were evil, they could technically gang up on you and try to combine their egos or something( are there rules for this sort of thing?)

 

[jefgorbach]

Afaik RAW only covers 1:1 ego battles.

However I agree it seems reasonable for those seeking to overwhelm the host to combine their efforts (as well as some rallying to its defense) so I'd suggest doing cascading rolls to decide which group of egos overwhelms the rest, continuing until a single decisive ego establishes control over the host body.