Copies of Spelljammer are starting to show up. Mike Long of Tribality is in receipt of the books and has tweeted some photos!
Domains of Dread (the 2e hardback book not the box set) had no native paladins, bards or druids. They could come from other lands via the Mists, but off limits to natives. Those that had lots of mechanical changes that weakened them.2e Ravenloft didn't ban paladins. It even let the DM know that domain lords were aware of exactly where every paladin in their realm was. The class wasn't banned, but it did carry a very short lifespan. I don't remember bards being banned, but then I've never liked bards, so I probably just tossed that out of my mind.
So I just pulled out my 2e Ravenloft to look at things closer. Paladins were in the character section, but had abilities altered and had the very probable short life span I mentioned. Priests got spells from their gods, but with some changes to some spells as noted in the book. Bards are not banned at all. It specifically mentions in the rogue section that any spells bards can cast are subject to the Ravenloft changes.
No classes were banned from that setting at all.
I don't know why you think power checks are gone. They're there, but in a different form. It takes the form of Dark Bargains and Dark Gifts. So it kept the powers checks and kept all classes being available. It got rid of the alterations to magic and didn't built in terror and horror checks, but the DMG has those, so they didn't need to put them into the setting. When all is said and done, not much actually changed.
I would expect the same of Dark Sun.
Exactly.Domains of Dread (the 2e hardback book not the box set) had no native paladins, bards or druids. They could come from other lands via the Mists, but off limits to natives. Those that had lots of mechanical changes that weakened them.
Dragonlance, iirc, eventually removed druids and changed paladins to fit the knighthoods. They also didn't have monks. I'm not a Dragonlance expert though.
But by 3e, all those restrictions had been tossed aside by the 3pp books. Much like how 4e Dark Sun (and 3e Paizo Dragon mag) fit most of those options into the setting.
I would lay odds that a 4e Dark Sun will not remove a single PC option in the PHB, aside from the canonically dead races. They will find a way to make every PHB option work without modification, just some heavy refluffing. They will add options, claim some are rare, but not remove any of them. Ten official settings later, I think we can call that a pattern.
Domains of Dread (the 2e hardback book not the box set) had no native paladins, bards or druids. They could come from other lands via the Mists, but off limits to natives. Those that had lots of mechanical changes that weakened them.
Dragonlance, iirc, eventually removed druids and changed paladins to fit the knighthoods. They also didn't have monks. I'm not a Dragonlance expert though.
But by 3e, all those restrictions had been tossed aside by the 3pp books. Much like how 4e Dark Sun (and 3e Paizo Dragon mag) fit most of those options into the setting.
I would lay odds that a 4e Dark Sun will not remove a single PC option in the PHB, aside from the canonically dead races. They will find a way to make every PHB option work without modification, just some heavy refluffing. They will add options, claim some are rare, but not remove any of them. Ten official settings later, I think we can call that a pattern.
Butting in. You're half-right. In the original boxed sets, paladins and bards where there. In Domains of Dread, put out in '97, the the tail end of 2e (it was copyright WotC) they replaced Paladins with Avengers and Bards with... well, let's just call them Vistani, shall we? They also introduced the Arcanist (wizard) and Anchorite (preist) classes. All of the classes--except for paladins and bards--were reprinted in this book. AFAICT, paladins and bards weren't banned, per se, but I think it was assumed (based on various forum posts and netzines that I've read) that paladins and bards could now only come from outside Ravenloft.2e Ravenloft didn't ban paladins. It even let the DM know that domain lords were aware of exactly where every paladin in their realm was. The class wasn't banned, but it did carry a very short lifespan. I don't remember bards being banned, but then I've never liked bards, so I probably just tossed that out of my mind.
So I just pulled out my 2e Ravenloft to look at things closer. Paladins were in the character section, but had abilities altered and had the very probable short life span I mentioned. Priests got spells from their gods, but with some changes to some spells as noted in the book. Bards are not banned at all. It specifically mentions in the rogue section that any spells bards can cast are subject to the Ravenloft changes.
No classes were banned from that setting at all.
It's not quite the same, though. Dark Bargains and Gifts are a deliberate player choice, while the Power Checks were a random DM punishment for PCs who performed evil acts. Players couldn't choose to fail a Powers check by RAW, although I'm sure some tables allowed it. Powers checks could also result in the PC becoming a Darklord, but I'm pretty sure that Dark Bargains and Gifts can't.I don't know why you think power checks are gone. They're there, but in a different form. It takes the form of Dark Bargains and Dark Gifts. So it kept the powers checks and kept all classes being available. It got rid of the alterations to magic and didn't built in terror and horror checks, but the DMG has those, so they didn't need to put them into the setting. When all is said and done, not much actually changed.
I need to reread the 4e Dark Version.Were I doing Dark Sun 5e at this point, my starting point would definitely be the 4e take on the setting.
I can live with slavery gone.From there I'd formally rename Muls to Half-dwarves, and strongly downplay or even simply eliminate references to slavery (the Sorcerer Kings become monstrous tyrants, but people don't outright own other people). That takes you most of the way there.
I find these three easy. Mostly.Rules-wise, the big difficulties lie in defiling, the role of Clerics, and psionics.
Yeah. This might even be a consensus. Make four new Cleric domains.For Clerics, I'd introduce Domains for any of the missing elements, and make those the only Domains in play in the setting.
Use background feats for psionic "Wild Talents". This is probably a consensus.For psionics, I'd introduce a couple of Wild Talent feats (previously I would have used subraces, like Eberron's Dragonmarks, but since subraces are being removed...), use the psionic options from Tasha's,
Personally, I need a Psion class for the feel of a Dark Sun setting.and call it a day - as a solution it sucks, but I don't have a better one.
Warlock mechanics are perfect.For defiling, I'd go one of two ways. I'm actually inclined to remove the Wizard class from play, and tie defiling into the Sorcerer's Sorcery Points. However, if that won't fly.
Converting Warlock spell slots into spell points works surprisingly well.I'd probably suggest opening Sorcery Points up to all arcane casters in a very limited sense (maybe allowing them to use them only to gain additional spell slots?).
Yeah. Once DMs Guild unlocks the Dark Sun setting, players can find whatever niche they need.But as @Yaarel says, that would very much be a matter of approximation, and not necessarily a particularly good approximation. In fact, I might suggest that might be best done as a DM's Guild product similar to "The Wayfarer's Guide to Eberron" - a book that exists mostly to provide a foundation for them to then open up the setting on the Guild.
This is the one bit of your post that really doesn't work for me. IMO, defiling needs to be an option available to all arcane casters at almost any time - it needs to be an ever-present temptation to take the easy way out at the cost of destroying the world. Gating it behind a feat (or background, or indeed and opt-in or opt-out mechanic) robs it of that value.Defiling:
Backgrounds can offer various Dark Sun theme feats, including psionic Wild Talents, but also including one feat for Preservers who figured out a way to cast arcane spells from destroying life, and one feat for Defilers who figured out a way to use this destruction to augment the power of their arcane spells. The Defiler feat can be as simple as imposing a disadvantage to saving throws against arcane spells, if there are enough plants within 10 feet that can be destroyed.