Question for the combo Astro [ffect] and Quantum [effect]

[Obly99]

Good day, I was reading IH when I got a question about the combo of Astro and Quantum [effect]

ASTRO [EFFECT] (SU) [Transcendental Ability]
You can create effects which can erase an opponent from reality.
Benefit:The effect causes damage as follows:
• Hand/Immolation Effects = 50% chance of destruction (1 in 2).
• Beam/Breath Effects = 25% chance of destruction (1 in 4).
• Blast/Wrath Effects = 12.5% chance of destruction (1 in 8).
• Blood/Storm/Strike Effects = 5% chance of destruction (1 in 20).
e.g. A Time Lord with Astro Breath would gain a breath weapon that would have a 1 in 4 chance of erasing all those caught within the area of effect.
Special: This effect can be taken multiple times and its effects stack. Each time it is taken it either applies to a different effect (see pages 116-117), or it applies to the same effect as follows:
Taken twice = Greater Astro [Effect], roll twice.
Taken three times = Superior Astro [Effect], roll three times.
Taken four times = Perfect Astro [Effect], roll four times.
Taken five times = Astro Mastery, use any type of astro effect.
Taken six times = Uncanny Astro Mastery, shape area effects to only target enemies.

QUANTUM EFFECT (SU) [Divine Ability]
You can empower your effects with the element of chance.
Prerequisites: At least one other [Effect] ability, any Neutral alignment.
Benefit: You can incorporate fate into your effects.
D20 Changes to Effect ability
1 Effect damage you (at normal strength)
2-3 No effect
4-6 Half Effect
7-14 No change (normal effect)
15-17 Works at double effect
18-19 Works at triple effect
20 Works at quadruple effect

If a Time Lord as both Astro Touch + Quantum plus its passive Evil Eye:
Evil Eye (Fate): You can manipulate the destiny of any beings within your divine aura. For instance you could choose to always gain the best dice rolls for you and your allies and bestow the worst on your enemies. Any being with the Inner Eye cosmic ability (see pg. 134) cannot have their destiny tampered with in this manner, however, they themselves would no longer always gain the best dice rolls (as per the benefits of the Inner Eye ability).
Do not make it an automatically auto-win? 50x4=200% of erase with no TS. Or do they interact in another way / has the community found a way to fix this over the years?

 

[Lordnightshade2]

Mmmm, i would say it doesn't affect it. Remember the chance to destroy is the chance for the Astro effect to take place while the quantum effect multiplies the effect when it takes place. this is why quantum multiplies damage most of the time so in this case it would multiple the effect of Astro Effect, which would do nothing since you cannot multiple complete erasure. so i say it does nothing when stacked with Astro effect

 

[Beefermatic]

Good day, I was reading IH when I got a question about the combo of Astro and Quantum [effect]

ASTRO [EFFECT] (SU) [Transcendental Ability]
You can create effects which can erase an opponent from reality.
Benefit:The effect causes damage as follows:
• Hand/Immolation Effects = 50% chance of destruction (1 in 2).
• Beam/Breath Effects = 25% chance of destruction (1 in 4).
• Blast/Wrath Effects = 12.5% chance of destruction (1 in 8).
• Blood/Storm/Strike Effects = 5% chance of destruction (1 in 20).
e.g. A Time Lord with Astro Breath would gain a breath weapon that would have a 1 in 4 chance of erasing all those caught within the area of effect.
Special: This effect can be taken multiple times and its effects stack. Each time it is taken it either applies to a different effect (see pages 116-117), or it applies to the same effect as follows:
Taken twice = Greater Astro [Effect], roll twice.
Taken three times = Superior Astro [Effect], roll three times.
Taken four times = Perfect Astro [Effect], roll four times.
Taken five times = Astro Mastery, use any type of astro effect.
Taken six times = Uncanny Astro Mastery, shape area effects to only target enemies.

QUANTUM EFFECT (SU) [Divine Ability]
You can empower your effects with the element of chance.
Prerequisites: At least one other [Effect] ability, any Neutral alignment.
Benefit: You can incorporate fate into your effects.
D20 Changes to Effect ability
1 Effect damage you (at normal strength)
2-3 No effect
4-6 Half Effect
7-14 No change (normal effect)
15-17 Works at double effect
18-19 Works at triple effect
20 Works at quadruple effect

If a Time Lord as both Astro Touch + Quantum plus its passive Evil Eye:
Evil Eye (Fate): You can manipulate the destiny of any beings within your divine aura. For instance you could choose to always gain the best dice rolls for you and your allies and bestow the worst on your enemies. Any being with the Inner Eye cosmic ability (see pg. 134) cannot have their destiny tampered with in this manner, however, they themselves would no longer always gain the best dice rolls (as per the benefits of the Inner Eye ability).
Do not make it an automatically auto-win? 50x4=200% of erase with no TS. Or do they interact in another way / has the community found a way to fix this over the years?

I wouldn't make it affect it either. Rule of thumb, if a combination of abilities makes the wheels of the game fall off, don't allow it.

That said. Astro Effect and Inner Eye...

 

[Obly99]

I wouldn't make it affect it either. Rule of thumb, if a combination of abilities makes the wheels of the game fall off, don't allow it.

That said. Astro Effect and Inner Eye...

The problem is not even the combination but Astro itself which is broken as the worst of things. Okay, at those levels many have Transmortality that makes you respawn but still it's a problem.

 

[Obly99]

One of my player proposed me a solution:
For the effect x4 instead work in this way for Astro:
Hand/Immolation Effects: [50 + (50 ÷ 4) + (50 ÷ 8) + (50 ÷ 16)] = 71%
Beam/Breath Effects: [25 + (25 ÷ 4) + (25 ÷ 8) + (25 ÷ 16)] = 35%
Blast/Wrath Effects: [12.5 + (12.5 ÷ 4) + (12.5 ÷ 8) + (12.5 ÷ 16)] = 17%
Blood/Storm/Strike Effects: [5 + (5 ÷ 4) + (5 ÷ 8) + (5 ÷ 16)] = 7%

 

[Beefermatic]

The problem is not even the combination but Astro itself which is broken as the worst of things. Okay, at those levels many have Transmortality that makes you respawn but still it's a problem.

It's really not that bad honestly. Compared to effects that erase HD or Divine Ranks or even deal permanent damage, this is honestly pretty mild. Look at the other effects at that level, that's just the playing field at ths point.

 

[Bootlebat]

I would rule inner eye doesn't work for percentile effects at all. Otherwise, it would make Undimensional (an omnific ability) useless, which seems way too powerful for a cosmic ability.

 

[Beefermatic]

One of my player proposed me a solution:
For the effect x4 instead work in this way for Astro:
Hand/Immolation Effects: [50 + (50 ÷ 4) + (50 ÷ 8) + (50 ÷ 16)] = 71%
Beam/Breath Effects: [25 + (25 ÷ 4) + (25 ÷ 8) + (25 ÷ 16)] = 35%
Blast/Wrath Effects: [12.5 + (12.5 ÷ 4) + (12.5 ÷ 8) + (12.5 ÷ 16)] = 17%
Blood/Storm/Strike Effects: [5 + (5 ÷ 4) + (5 ÷ 8) + (5 ÷ 16)] = 7%

Honestly a less clunky solution is to just not allow the ability if you're uncomfortable with it. I did that for the Mime ability divine power. There were no limitations so I made it unable to be taken, reworked it and reallowed the updated version.m, but plenty of abilities I frankly just don't allow. Or don't allow to stack. I just wouldn't let it stack

 

[Beefermatic]

I would rule inner eye doesn't work for percentile effects at all. Otherwise, it would make Undimensional (an omnific ability) useless, which seems way too powerful for a cosmic ability.

Not if you also have inner eye. You'll always end with 20 levels of invincibility at higher levels that's why having a party is important and abrogate is the most important ability. You can't beat even a First One without the Abrogate ability or a party of people peeling off layers of an enemy's defenses, but it is very satisfying to see a supposedly "invincible" foe get taken down because it's entirely possible.