Proposed Monk Rules Preview (not house rules)

[Artoomis]

This.

Now, you -are- correct in the idea that an unarmed attacker theme is perfectly viable, flavor-wise. However, you have not provided one. What you've provided is a theme that is only good for unarmed attackers. It does not -make- you a good unarmed attacker unless you already were.

A better way to do it would be to forgo the level 1 encounter power and replace it with this:

'You are proficient in unarmed weapons. The unarmed strike gives you a +3 proficiency bonus, and has 1d8 weapon damage. If you are not wielding a weapon or carrying a shield, you gain +1 to attack rolls.'

This way, you have a theme that works well with monks and brawlers, but also gives unarmed capabilities to other classes that might desire it. This is how a theme should work, opening up concepts, not bandaging concepts you don't find work perfectly.

You've given me a good idea - I've gone back and tweaked the starting feature.

 

[DracoSuave]

You've given me a good idea - I've gone back and tweaked the starting feature.

No problem. I happen to think pugilism is something that can be shared amongst many classes. I wouldn't mind playing an executioner pugilist for one.

 

[Artoomis]

No problem. I happen to think pugilism is something that can be shared amongst many classes. I wouldn't mind playing an executioner pugilist for one.

I am done for now (how long that will last, I don't know). I think it is much better due to your (and others) input. I like it better now than where I started. I think it's pretty cool and has a pseudo-defender feel to it which works well for a high-mobility PC like the monk. You could move to the back rank and then maybe keep the bad guy glass cannon from running away. Not many other PCs can do this, so this is pretty cool and a bit of a new concept for a monk without changing the existing class.

Cool.

P.S.: In addition to other changes, I also added a new feat:

Pugilist Flurry
Heroic Tier
Prerequisite: Monk, Flurry of Blows class feature
Benefit: When using your monk's Flurry of Blows class feature, if the triggering attack was made unarmed you can forego the normal damage from the Flurry for any target(s) and instead have the target(s) immobilized until the start of your next turn.

 

[mneme]

Yes, the theme makes much more sense if it grants you Unarmed Strike -- as then it is both useful for monks who want to specialize in unarmed and for other characters who want to be competent without a weapon.

 

[Artoomis]

Yes, the theme makes much more sense if it grants you Unarmed Strike -- as then it is both useful for monks who want to specialize in unarmed and for other characters who want to be competent without a weapon.

Yep - it's much better now, and more closely aligned with other non-Dark Sun themes. If there are other ideas, keep 'em coming.

I may not comment any more for about a week as I will be out of town and I am not taking my laptop with me. I'll catch up when I get back.

 

[Jeremy Ackerman-Yost]

I'm not an expert on balance, but Empty Palm seems a bit on the strong side. Just on its own merits, it's nearly auto-pick, IMO, without getting into the fact that it's an MBA, which effectively saves you a feat if you want to have a decent OA. At will immobilize that can be used as an MBA feels cheese-able.

You would be the Warlord's best friend and/or dream date, especially if you have stances like Masterful Spiral, so they don't even need to be adjacent to you.

It might be strong enough to consider adding a requirement like "must have both hands free."

 

[Artoomis]

I'm not an expert on balance, but Empty Palm seems a bit on the strong side. Just on its own merits, it's nearly auto-pick, IMO, without getting into the fact that it's an MBA, which effectively saves you a feat if you want to have a decent OA. At will immobilize that can be used as an MBA feels cheese-able.

You would be the Warlord's best friend and/or dream date, especially if you have stances like Masterful Spiral, so they don't even need to be adjacent to you.

It might be strong enough to consider adding a requirement like "must have both hands free."

Maybe, but consider the other At Will powers usable as MBAs (unrestricted) for other classes and the extras they get:

Paladin, Virtuous Strike, MBA, gain a +2 bonus to saving throws until the start of your next turn.

Fighter, Wicked Strike, MBA, Extra Con damage (double at level 21)

Cleric, Sonnlinor's Hammer, The next attack the target makes before the end of your next turn takes a penalty to the damage roll equal to your Charisma modifier.

Sorceror, Ensorcelled Blade, If the target hits or misses you with a melee attack before the start of your next turn, it takes damage equal to the extra damage from your Spell Source class feature.

Vampire, Vampire Slam, you can push the target 1 square.

Druid, Grasping Claws, the target is slowed until the end of your next turn

Druid, Savage Rend, you slide the target 1 square

There are a fair number usable only when charging or making an OA, notably:

Fighter, Grappling Strike, MBA for OA only, you grab the target. The grab ends automatically at the end of your next turn.

It seems to be balanced against those, I think, especially when considering that the movement part of the full discipline is not really very impressive compared to others. It's ... interesting, certainly... but rather limiting in that you must end up next to the target.

The damage needs to be d6 though, not d8, due to imposing the immobilized condition and the fact that this can be used as an MBA.

 

[DracoSuave]

Pugilist Flurry
Heroic Tier
Prerequisite: Monk, Flurry of Blows class feature
Benefit: When using your monk's Flurry of Blows class feature, if the triggering attack was made unarmed you can forego the normal damage from the Flurry for any target(s) and instead have the target(s) immobilized until the start of your next turn.

I like this.

 

[Jeremy Ackerman-Yost]

With the d6 damage die, I think it's actually very comparable to Grasping Claws now, but that's just my gut talking.

Grappling Strike is reminding me that I need to play a Brawler Fighter at some point.

 

[Artoomis]

I got an answer from WotC!

First, they want submissions like this to be more focused on the story in the submission.

Second, they said:

"We already have some monk support planned for an upcoming issue, based on conversations happening on our character optimization boards. Consequently, we’re not looking for more monk articles at the moment."

This is very encouraging. Cool!! I hope they use some of this material.