D&D (2024) Playtest 8 Monk Discussion

[mellored]

Pretty limited experience, but IMO.

They still need something at level 1, and deflect attacks is a bit too strong at level 3, especially since you get the subclass them too. So tweaking things a little.

Deflect Attacks (level 1)
Martial arts die (1d6) + monk level

Improved Deflect Attacks (level 5)
Martial arts die + Dex + monk level

 

[Vikingkingq]

I think the Monk's level 1 issues are dealt with by the change to Martial Arts that allow them to Dodge/Bonus Unarmed Strike (and then Dodge/Flurry at level 2).

 

[Clint_L]

I think the Monk's level 1 issues are dealt with by the change to Martial Arts that allow them to Dodge/Bonus Unarmed Strike (and then Dodge/Flurry at level 2).

Yeah, I didn't initially realize how significant untying the unarmed strike from the attack action was. In play, you kind of start thinking of the action as the bonus action in some situations.

For example, at level 10, you have have two distinct tanking options. If you're really in the thick of it, you can use the bonus action for Patient Defence. I've never used the free disengage with this, but having dodge, plus extra temporary hit points, plus deflect attack makes you a very strong tank, and you are still getting two attacks. My monk is AC 21 (dex 20, wis 16, bracers of defence, ring of protection) and she is very, very hard to take down now.

Or, if you don't need to be quite that beefy, you take the dodge action and still get three attacks off flurry of blows. (I'm playing a mercy monk though, so if the target isn't immune to poison and she's 1v1, she doesn't need to worry about using doge at all. Options!).

Right from level 1 you can always have the dodge action up while still getting offence in. Which, on top of getting hit less often overall, also makes you virtually immune to taking a critical hit in melee. At level 1, a surprise critical does in more characters than anything else.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

Yeah, I didn't initially realize how significant untying the unarmed strike from the attack action was. In play, you kind of start thinking of the action as the bonus action in some situations.

Actually that was obvious in the first reading and it was pointed out repeatedly in all monk threads.

Cool that your experience in actual play confirms that.

 

[Mistwell]

Yeah, I didn't initially realize how significant untying the unarmed strike from the attack action was.

Actually that was obvious in the first reading and it was pointed out repeatedly in all monk threads.

Question for you UngeheuerLich. What was the purpose of this comment in your mind when you made it? Genuinely curious if you thought it served a purpose different than how it comes across.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

Question for you UngeheuerLich. What was the purpose of this comment in your mind when you made it? Genuinely curious if you thought it served a purpose different than how it comes across.

I honestly don't understand the surprise expressed in his comment. The monk seemed pretty OP in the first reading.

 

[Mistwell]

I honestly don't understand the surprise expressed in his comment. The monk seemed pretty OP in the first reading.

Person A didn't realize X when they first read Y.
Person B (You) realized X when they first read Y.

What did you think the purpose is when B tells A they found it "obvious" what Person A missed on first read?

It implies one of two things as from my perspective. Either you think Person A is lying about their impression on first read because it was so obvious they had to have noticed it if they read it, or it implies Person B thinks they're much smarter and person A is dumber for not having noticed something so obvious on first read. Neither of those possibilities serves a useful purpose other than being rude in what had been a fairly non-aggressive conversation. HOWEVER, I might be missing something (because my perspective is fallible) and there could be other intentions involved. Which is why I asked you what your purpose was in the comment, rather than just assuming it had to be one of the two I outlined.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

Person A didn't realize X when they first read Y.
Person B (You) realized X when they first read Y.

What did you think the purpose is when B tells A they found it "obvious" what Person A missed on first read?

It implies one of two things as from my perspective. Either you think Person A is lying about their impression on first read because it was so obvious they had to have noticed it if they read it, or it implies Person B thinks they're much smarter and person A is dumber for not having noticed something so obvious on first read. Neither of those possibilities serves a useful purpose other than being rude in what had been a fairly non-aggressive conversation. HOWEVER, I might be missing something (because my perspective is fallible) and there could be other intentions involved. Which is why I asked you what your purpose was in the comment, rather than just assuming it had to be one of the two I outlined.

You are correct. I mixed up something. Although I noted directly on page 1 or 2 that this is a gamechanger, it was not ClintL who I was arguing with. So I hope he accepts my apology, that I was indeed rude towards him.
I really mixed something up, because I remembered him being very negative of the monk changes at first. So sorry @ClintL (if you can still read my posts).

Thanks @Mistwell for pointing out my misbehavior.

 

[Mistwell]

You are correct. I mixed up something. Although I noted directly on page 1 or 2 that this is a gamechanger, it was not ClintL who I was arguing with. So I hope he accepts my apology, that I was indeed rude towards him.
I really mixed something up, because I remembered him being very negative of the monk changes at first. So sorry @ClintL (if you can still read my posts).

Thanks @Mistwell for pointing out my misbehavior.

I mess up in thinking I was talking to someone else all the time, so perfectly understandable.

 

[Clint_L]

It's cool. I was very negative towards the original monk redesign. I loved the new one right from the start, but the full impact of moving unarmed strike to the bonus action only became clear when playing it. In many situations, the bonus action is the where you get the biggest impact, so much so that your action can feel secondary.