[ot, spoilers] Enterprise 27-2-02

Don

First Post
ColonelHardisson said:

I don't think T'Pol has shown an inordinate amount of emotion, espacially when compared to other Vulcans we've seen so far on Enterprise. Remember that captain of the ship that was shadowing Enterprise, who was invited to dinner?

Yes, now that you mention it, that Vulcan captain was a jerk. And the one Vulcan in the pilot (played by the same guy who played detective Sykes in the Alien Nation TV series) got pretty emotional, too.

Ah, for the days of the cool, calculating, unemotional Mr. Spock...(and he was *half human*!)
 

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Aaron L

Hero
Vulcans have a gland that supresses emotion? That's wonky. Why did they almost tear themselves apart because of their overpowerd emotions and have to develop a non-emotional total logic philosophy then?
 

Personally I am getting sick and tired of vulcans in general and I wish they would stop focusing every other episode on the 'master race'.

I mean come on, they are:

stronger
faster
smarter
see better
hear better
able to adjust their bodies to not need sleep for days on end
lightly telepathic

It just gets VERY boring after a while seeing them on the screen all the time.

BTW, am I the only one that thinks that one vulcan a$$ from the show should have been thrown in the brig for multiple assault and battery charges?
 

Masked

First Post
Ciaran said:


Last I checked, it's not that Vulcans are unemotional, but that they have tight emotion control to handle the fact that they can get very emotional. Presumably this came up in that episode... unfortunately I missed it.

It was mentioned. The Vulcan who looked like Luke Perry said to T'Pol that her emotions are much closer to the surface than other Vulcans. However, the Vulcans in episode one sure got angry a.k.a. emotional, though I can't remember why.

However, that could be explained as having to do with their contact with humans for 70 years.

:rolleyes:
 

Why was he getting mad?

Simple, the stupid humans were not automatically doing what they were told. They were actually daring to question and disagree with the almighty Vulcan on the scene.


Masked said:


It was mentioned. The Vulcan who looked like Luke Perry said to T'Pol that her emotions are much closer to the surface than other Vulcans. However, the Vulcans in episode one sure got angry a.k.a. emotional, though I can't remember why.

However, that could be explained as having to do with their contact with humans for 70 years.

:rolleyes:
 

Lizard

Explorer
Don said:


Yes, now that you mention it, that Vulcan captain was a jerk. And the one Vulcan in the pilot (played by the same guy who played detective Sykes in the Alien Nation TV series) got pretty emotional, too.

Ah, for the days of the cool, calculating, unemotional Mr. Spock...(and he was *half human*!)

Which means he may have been overcompensating -- that is, being "more Vulcan than thou" in order to overcome the stigma of his heritage.
 

Wolf72

Explorer
constant struggle

I do like how they've vulcans seem more fallible, they NEED to Meditate everynight.

they show minor emotions, they're not robots after all ...

from what I've seen so far the few times a vuclans gotten into a physical fight they've gotten knocked down. This may be because of lack of experience, or that the adrenaline that pumps them up is mostly active during emotional or ritual (Kirk and Spock to the death, Jim Carrey's "Cable Guy" rendition was fantastic!).

with a little luck I should be able to start an andromeda thread for this weekend too ... :)
 

Methinkus

First Post
My gosh man, am I the only one who thinks vulcans in general are the worst idea for a race of alien critters on TV in the history of TV?

How am I, as a viewer, supposed to become interested in a people who are actually incapable of showing emotion? "Oh well as long as it won't bother you I was just thinking about how much I would like to sleep with your wife there. I promise I'll wear a rubber, see you in the morning, you don't mind sleepin on the couch do you? No? Great. You're the best,"

I swear I almost slipped into a freaking coma while I was sitting through those dialogs between T'Pol and her "emotional" vulcan buddy it was so boring. Lousy vulcans and their Master Race mentality. . . . . .

Oh and on a side note: My first post! Wahoo!
 

Mark

CreativeMountainGames.com
Welcome, Methinkus! :) Pardon me if I ramble a bit about a thing or two... :D

ColonelHardisson said:
Every version of Trek since TOS has been rampant with episodes where the crew won't ever remember what happened - almost all of them had to do with time travel.

It's true they didn't treat time travel the same way in TOS, but they had their episodes also. I think most people, when they say they dislike time travel episodes (and don't include TOS time travel episodes) are really taking a dislike to how they are treated.

----------------------------

Here's a link to a nice little summary site, though people may disagree with the author's "grades" of the episodes-
http://science.csustan.edu/JTB/GUIDES/TREK/trek-index.htm )

First Season: Tomorrow is Yesterday - In the past by accident, air force pilot is picked up, must be returned.

First Season: City On The Edge of Forever - Thru a time portal after McCoy to a woman on histories turning point.

Second Season: Assignment Earth - In the past, the crew almost stops Gary Seven from preventing war.

Third Season: All Our Yesterdays - Thru a portal go, Kirk to a 'Salem', and Bones & Spock to ice an age.

-------------------------

I think that ColH is making the distinction as being the treatment, and not time travel in general, as being what he dislikes but let's strive onward.

I'm of a mind that the "alternate possible pasts" of later (than TOS) series were trying to deal with things in what they wished to be perceived as a more realistic treatment of the cause and effect relationship time travel suggests and the theory of many, if not infinite, threads in time.

Perhaps it will turn out that the current relationship that Earth has with the Vulcans will not be the actual one if it is effected by the Temporal Cold War story arc?

Reagrding this latest new episode of Enterprise...

I like the way they are portraying Vulcans and think it is in keeping with all of the series and movies. I think it is probably not good to use Spock examples since he is of mixed heritage, but there are other Vulcans to cite as less than paragons of emotional control. In TOS, Sarek had a human wife, not very logical. His arrogance when visiting the Enterprise as an ambassador certainly shows his emotional attempts of emotional detachment regarding his relationship with his half-human son (Spock).

I'll squeeze some examples from the movies in here because they deal primarily with the original cast. Kirsty Alley often showed frustration while trying to learn the ropes and her substitute in The Search for Spock might have been a tad less emotional. Spock's brother, anyone? There's a fine example of what happens when a Vulcan embraces his emotion to the point of abandoning reasoning and grasp of reality.

TNG replaced the Vulcan "concept" with Data, obviously to distance themselves from TOS, but had some episodes with Vulcans. Sarek arrogantly and stubbornly held a long standing alienation of his half-human son (Spock), which is emotional. The madness Sarek goes through in old age, is another example of the emotion/logic struggle that is part of the Vulcan "make up".

DSN seemed to be going even further to avoid any relationship with past episode's plots, and notably in how they avoided Vulcans as characters. The only time Vulcans were used, IIRC, was in the Baseball episode and that was in a holodeck. I can't recall if the Vulcans were a program or real but I believe the former. No real examples here, then.

VOY has Tuvok, and while some will dismiss all of Voyager as the worst of all Trek, I'm not so quick to say so myself. Regardless, it had both good and bad things about it just like any of the series, IMO. For the purposes of this post, it is a wealth of Vulcan examples of the struggle with emotion. To my mind they are too numerous to recount but, I think anyone with a familiarity of Voyager will agree, it was sprinkled with Tuvok episodes and most of those dealt with his Vulcan problems with that struggle.

All in all I'd have to say that the real problem is that they may not have established, at any time in the history of Star Trek, that Vulcans are the epitome of logic. They have always asserted it in the scripted word but more often than not appearances of Vulcans usually deal with their tenuous grasp of their emotional control rather than their supreme ability to hold those emotions in check.
 

Ancalagon

Dusty Dragon
Greetings

On spock overcompensating:

Very plausible. Just look at how Worf was more klegon (especialy on the honor thing) than most klegon, despite having been raised by humans...

I think that DS9 started very slowly but got realy good. I guess it depends if you like politics or not.

Ancalagon
 

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