D&D General One thing I hate about the Sorcerer

[Raiztt]

Isn't #2 a subsection of #1?

yes but we're talking about from the user/protagonists perspective:

I am magical vs. I am borrowing magic vs. I became magical.

 

[TwoSix]

If I had to guess, and this could be a totally unfounded opinion, but I'd be willing to suggest that the wizard as D&D knows it now was greatly influenced by HPL. Where in magic was almost always a function of obtaining esoteric lore.

Putting on my amateur/armchair historian and anthropologist hat it seems to be that we have, broadly, three different 'core' types of magic that gets represented over and over again in human history:

1.) It's actually divine/you're empowered by (or actually are) a god.
2.) It's borrowed from something that is innately magical.
3.) It's something that you can actually learn to manipulate.

I think these also largely track with human history as it goes forward from earlier to present.

Pretty much agree. I tend to see three broad categories, which definitely overlap yours.

1) Transformation/possession. Someone was born as, or eventually transforms into, something more than, or less than, human.
2) Chosen. Granted power by an external entity, usually as part of a greater purpose/destiny.
3) Acquistion. Power is found or learned via a tool/item/secret knowledge, often at risk. Often part of a greater test of virtue.

 

[Gorck]

yes but we're talking about from the user/protagonists perspective:

I am magical vs. I am borrowing magic vs. I became magical.

Which sounds an awful lot like the 5e Sorcerer vs. Warlock vs. Wizard respectively

 

[Shardstone]

D&D's nonsense magic categorizations arise from the seperation of the Arcane and Divine. Magic and divinity are intertwined in every single culture. Nothing exists that is arcane that is outside of any given culture's idea of the divine. The fact that D&D does so has always felt artificial to me as a response. And then you have the separation of Primal and Divine...like...ok.

I know a lot of people like these categorizations, I don't mean to yuk your yum, but man it really just makes the different casters all feel so artificial. I think the only time I've really dug the concept is in Elden Ring, which specifically calls out the categories as artificial and says that secretly its all the same thing just interpreted in different ways.

 

[Crimson Longinus]

WotC just is unable to be consistent with their metaphysics. Just choose a source per class and stick to it, how hard can it be?

Some sorcerers can’t name the origin of their
power, while others trace it to strange events in their
own lives. The touch of a demon,

A fiend pact warlock

the blessing of a dryad

A fey pact warlock

at a baby’s birth, or a taste of the water from
a mysterious spring might spark the gift o f sorcery.
So too might the gift of a deity of magic,

A cleric.

Some o f these bloodlines are well
established in the world, but most are obscure. Any
given sorcerer could be the first of a new bloodline, as a
result of a pact or some other exceptional circumstance.

Again, a warlock.

It's just a mess.

 

[Swarmkeeper]

Say what you will but, at least, no self-respecting sorcerer would ever be caught wearing glasses.

/ducks

 

[Vaalingrade]

WotC just is unable to be consistent with their metaphysics. Just choose a source per class and stick to it, how hard can it be?

I mean, as far as I can tell they're now saying ALL magic comes from FR's Weave, which comes from a divine source, so even choosing a source won't help with the sea of chaos anymore.

 

[Minigiant]

WotC just is unable to be consistent with their metaphysics. Just choose a source per class and stick to it, how hard can it be?


A fiend pact warlock


A fey pact warlock


A cleric.


Again, a warlock.

It's just a mess.

Actually
If you reread those examples, they are 100% consistent.

 

[Crimson Longinus]

Actually
If you reread those examples, they are 100% consistent.

With being a warlock? No, one was a cleric.

 

[Minigiant]

With being a warlock? No, one was a cleric.

With being a sorcerer.