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Microlite20 : the smallest thing in gaming

jezter6

Explorer
Right. So if you're not going to get near 20th level, and the wizard has the same bab (within +2) of the fighter...why be the fighter?

I don't see the benefit at all. At least in full d20 you get lots of feats AND the full BAB progression to keep pace with the wizard.

Considering that AC and such don't change from d20 to m20 - the wizard can become a powerful front line fighter, possibly moreso than that fighter with an armor spell and something like a 'greater magic weapon' type spell.
 

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Pilsnerquest

First Post
I suppose the loss of hit points for casting the buffs would be the main balancing factor. How many hit points would a mage lose for keeping up a higher AC and attack?


Pilsnerquest
 


Ry

Explorer
I am going to start another thread about this, but here's my wicked-cool setting idea that I'd love to see an m20-oid handle. Think of an intrigue-filled wild west set a thousand years after victorian steampunk (not severe magic chaos like eberron's last war).

I'm a firm believer that PC classes tell the story best:

Gunslinger
(Like a Ranger, no animal companions, must go ranged combat). Part of a brotherhood that has tremendous respect but very little political power. Code binds the gunslingers (i.e., must accept duels) but it's not alignment-based, so gunslingers can be on opposing sides of all sorts of conflicts. Code includes being impartial and sticking to the terms of a bargain. Non-gunslingers with guns are hunted down by the gunslingers, as are major violators of the code. Gunslingers must aid each other when someone breaks the terms of a gunslinger's contract. No weapons may be drawn in the presence of a gunsmith (gunsmiths are the non-combatant judges / craftsmen / trainers of the order).

Shaman
Setting's spirits are all incorporeal and unseen, but run the gamut from fickle tricksters to ancestor ghosts to nature spirits. There are also demons in the world, but they're your enemies.

Advocate
(Ninja-like abilities, esp. momentary invisibility and lethal strikes) Played as trained members of Houses, which are like crime families in a world with no police to get in the way. Imagine if rather than the Cavalry showing up, all you could hope for in the wild west was the arrival of the currently dominant local crime family. They are the political powers of the setting. These Houses span the setting - so if you make enemies of a House in one place, you've got enemies in lots of places. Houses know better than to try to acquire firearms, and they know well enough to hire Gunslingers when necessary. Advocates' secret fighitng style, including their ability to move undetected and make deadly strikes is passed from one generation to the next in a kind of assassin's apprenticeship. Advocates reach the highest levels of power within their Houses, although Advocates don't reveal that they are anything more than other gentlemen belonging to their Houses unless they have to.

Warlock
(somewhere between the concepts of warlock and binder in D&D) You made the deal, maybe under duress, or maybe for good reasons. Now you get the benefits. There are many demons in the world, and they can be used... but they can use you too. What's important, though, is that you stay alive, because you're not looking forward to what's waiting for you on the other side.

Tetsujin (metal men)
Fighters are tetsujin, and tetsujin are fighters. Played largely as-is (using stats for Warforged or Ironborn or whatever). They are found in some ancient ruins, and about a hundred years ago someone figured out how to wake them up. They don't know who they are, they don't know how they were made. Often this means they can be used by others, and they're sought after by the Houses.

These options are designed to provide cool character options but also require some kind of conflict to be built into each character.

Characters start at level 3 and cap at level 10, after which they gain feats only. Since each class has a very specific "order" or cultural context, no multiclassing. However, characters besides Fighters could become Warlocks if they make a pact and do an hour long ritual involving the consent and agreement of an actual demon, losing all other abilities in exchange for a Warlock's abilities.

Imagine this as a dusky setting, with ruined castles covered by vines found in the wilderness in a world that has not seen a "nation" in a thousand years. The great conflicts have played themselves out, and while the scars have healed, this is not an age of rebirth. Small towns and large towns are the rule throughout the setting. Centres of power are fortresses. Characters are humans only except for fighters (see below). Alignment is not used, magic is strange, and resurrection is impossible.

NPCs have NPC classes.

Monsters in the setting are the result of demons messing with the natural environment - which is why they pop up near peaceful settlements. Magic items are rare, and are either from demons, relics of the people who built the Warforged, or both. Any evil outsider is a candidate for a demon, are any intelligent evil monsters.
 


Ry

Explorer
In tone I think it will end up being pretty close to Stephen King's Dark Tower series (worth the read, at least until I stopped halfway though Wizard and Glass). I may add some kind of Telekinetic / Seer Psion (invisible effects only) with the moral trappings of Arcana Unearthed's Runechildren.
 

greywulf

First Post
Pilsnerquest said:
I suppose the loss of hit points for casting the buffs would be the main balancing factor. How many hit points would a mage lose for keeping up a higher AC and attack?

Exactly right. The Magi and Cleric's balancing factor is the HP cost for casting spells. Magic takes it's toll on mortal frames!

Ry, the settig sounds great!

In m20 terms, I'd suggest the following:

Gunslinger: Fighter, with a Masterwork gun. If they use light armour, give them the ability to use Track (Sub+MIND) at +1 or somesuch
Shaman: Cleric, possible using 4x5 magic system to reflect their spirit's specialities
Advocate: Rogue
Tetsujin: Fighter
Warlock: Magi, again, 4x5 or even Open Ended Magic

Does that make sense?

I last night's game in Chicago 300 years in the future. The city is in post-apocalypse ruin and the adventurers were hunting for the ruins of the old Chicago Library. They used the Open Ended Magic System for the Magi and he loved it, though intentionally kept things on a tight rein. The OEMS is very easy to abuse we found! Also, goblins in cars rock, bigtime.

More on that another time though!
 


greywulf

First Post
A clever player can do literally anything in the OEMS which is good as if reflects the reality-warping nature of magic, but can easily trash a game.

In one encounter a bridge into a town was being held by Geneskins (big green mutated humans with ugly dental work - orcs, in other words). The New God (Magi) caused a crack in the keystone which brought down the entire bridge, orcs and all. Simple spell, DC10+range. Brilliant.

Later on he sets fire to to the library with a wave of his hands, the rest of the party fleeing the scene with the precious book in their hands.

After the game ended Mark said that he kept having to stop himself casting spells to solve every problem. Locked door - no problem. Orc horde? No problem. Car wouldn't start? no problem. That cost of DC +2 for each spell cast meant balancing the needs of now with ending up with a really high DC in the future when you need the magic to work against the BBEG. We agreed there's no way we'd allow more than one Magi using the Open Ended Magic System in a party. The temptation to have one cast spells in the morning then the other later in the day when the other's DC is maxed out is too great. OEMS Magi rock a little too much!

Oh, and the book they were after in this post-apocalypse world of mutant horror?

The last remaining copy of the Da Vinci Code. What else? :)
 

kensanata

Explorer
Magic

Maybe it would be worth investing magic with some kind of karma system. A crack in the floor is not the same as a crack in a supporting pillar of a stone bridge with 100 orcs on it. Now in a scenario where the magicians are the new Immortals striving for Godhood, I think you'd need to formulate it as a basic law of the universe. Something like these C.S. Lewis laws "from the dawn of time".

I guess it also goes to show that the HP drain is "better" than the DC increase... ;)
 

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