MIC- Did the price of mithral change? Is mithral armor too cheap?

[Baramay]

Balance isn't the only issue in D&D.

Also, Adamantium is really hard to sunder.

Balance is important, that is why we have CR, character wealth by level, etc Regarding changes in buff spell duration from 3.0 to 3.5 I would conclude some game designers find balance to be important as well.

The most important reason is character balance. If players are not having fun because one character is outshining the others then there is a problem. You can try to rectify this by controling encounters and finding ways to nerf the shining one but in the end it becomes railroading.

Armor cannot be sundered. Mithral and adamantium weapons operate quite differently.

 

[The Blow Leprechaun]

Armor cannot be sundered.

Maybe I'm misreading your post, but if you're trying to make this point, then you're wrong. Armor can indeed be sundered. You make a roll against the object's AC to damage it. http://www.systemreferencedocuments.org/35/sovelior_sage/specialAttacks.html

 

[the_mighty_agrippa]

Half-plate is the Daewoo automobile version of armor. As soon as you can, you trade up to something work a damn.

Adamantine armor gives DR, which is a huge bonus to fighting types.

 

[Ender_rpm]

Maybe I'm misreading your post, but if you're trying to make this point, then you're wrong. Armor can indeed be sundered. You make a roll against the object's AC to damage it. http://www.systemreferencedocuments.org/35/sovelior_sage/specialAttacks.html

Read your own link my friend "You can’t sunder armor worn by another character."

 

[The Blow Leprechaun]

Read your own link my friend "You can’t sunder armor worn by another character."

But you can sunder armor.

 

[werk]

But you can sunder armor.

but only when you wouldn't want to...

oops, I didn't mean to post that.

 

[The Blow Leprechaun]

but only when you wouldn't want to...

I can see lots of fun applications - PCs return to their home base to find their possessions not stolen (and therefore recoverable), but broken into little pieces.

Maybe the bad guy, realizing he won't win this fight, sunders the magic armor on the pedestal that would have otherwise been a great reward for the PCs.

Bad guys use the mechanics, too, not just PCs.

 

[The Souljourner]

Nate, you are entitled to your opinion but could you cite some reasons based on the numbers I have presented, or your own.

Well, I gave my reasons in the original post, but let me post in a different way:

Light Armor
- gains zero benefit from the "counts as lighter armor"
- is proportionally more difficult to saturate the dex maximum
- little benefit from half physical weight (already pretty light)
- Requires least amount of physical material
- Requires least amount of time and skill to craft

Medium Armor
- gains highest benefit of "counts as lighter armor" (removes movement penalty)
- similar difficulty in saturating dex maximum (only slightly easier)
- more benefit from half physical weight
- Requires slightly more physical material
- requires slightly more time and skill to craft

Heavy Armor
- Large benefit for some classes by counting as medium armor (barbarians, others who don't know heavy armor)
- Easiest to saturate dex maximum (+2 or 3 is pretty achievable)
- Highest combined maximum armor bonus and dex bonus in game
- Highest benefit from 1/2 weight loss
- highest volume of physical material needed
- highest amount of time and skill to craft


A fighter, cleric, paladin, or other heavy armor wearer is generally going to have a 12 dex when he starts, maybe 13 if he wants dodge feats. In order to "fill out" mithral full plate, he only has to spend 16,000gp on gloves of dex.

If the above-mentioned character wanted to try to fill out a mithral chain shirt, it wouldn't even be possible without inherent bonuses and/or stat increases.

Even a dex-based character who starts with 16 dex needs a +4 dex item to fill out a mithral chain shirt, and that assumes he's 8th+ and puts stat increases in dex at 4th and 8th. That same character could put on regular-old fullplate +1 for much less money without the stat increases and get the exact same total bonus to AC.

So.... that's why I think it makes perfect sense for mithral to be more expensive for heavier armors.

-Nate

 

[werk]

I can see lots of fun applications - PCs return to their home base to find their possessions not stolen (and therefore recoverable), but broken into little pieces.

Maybe the bad guy, realizing he won't win this fight, sunders the magic armor on the pedestal that would have otherwise been a great reward for the PCs.

Bad guys use the mechanics, too, not just PCs.

Oh, bad guys use them, but not really. You think a DM is going to figure out how many times the bad guy had to hit the armor, calculating damage and hardness and whatnot? No, he's going to say, "he broke your stuff"

Yes, you can damage armor as an object, but that really isn't sundering in the pure sense of the word. "You can use a melee attack with a slashing or bludgeoning weapon to strike a weapon or shield that your opponent is holding. "

 

[The Blow Leprechaun]

Oh, bad guys use them, but not really. You think a DM is going to figure out how many times the bad guy had to hit the armor, calculating damage and hardness and whatnot? No, he's going to say, "he broke your stuff"

Yes, you can damage armor as an object, but that really isn't sundering in the pure sense of the word. "You can use a melee attack with a slashing or bludgeoning weapon to strike a weapon or shield that your opponent is holding. "

Play with semantics all you want, the fact remains that armor can be sundered. Whether you would want to or not is irrelevant. If the initial statement had read "Armor cannot be sundered when worn," then I would be wrong and would freely admit it, but it just said "armor cannot be sundered," and I wanted to make it clear that armor does not enjoy some mystical protection against being destroyed. I think that's been made clear, so there's no further need of this side discussion, is there?