Keen/Improved Critical Madness!

[Taren Nighteyes]

Does anyone here think the Keen magic and Improved Critical feat are WAY too powerful when used with certain weapons? (like the scimitar??)

Scimitar crit range of 18-20
with keen 15-20??
and improved crit 12-20????


I was thinking of house ruling the keen/improved crit options as follows:

They add +1 to the crit range for all weapons and still stack.


That seems quite balanced, at least initially.

What do you guys think?


Thanks,

Taren Nighteyes

 

[Aaron2]

Keen + Improved Crit

If you do the math, you find that Keen and Improved crit are more effective on weapons with 20/ *3 weapons than 19/*2 ones. That is because if you miss you don't crit regardless of your threat range. Unless the monsters your fighting has a pretty bad AC for your level, crit'ing on a 12 won't do you much good.

In either case, I wouldn't worry about it.

Aaron

 

[Crothian]

It looks worse then it is in my expeience. Play with it is for a few months and then take a look at it. So far my groups have not had any problems with it

 

[Valicor]

Don't punnish him for mastering his weapon

How exactly is this over powered?

Scimitar, Rapier or Falchion18 to 20
becomes 15-20 with Improved Critical
and 12-20 With Keen.

Lets look at the damage first all these weapons only have a x2, so they are more acurate, and hit lighter. As you gt into stronger weapons they are less acurate and hit harder.

Falchion 2d4: 18-20 x2
Scythe 2d4: 20 x4

Rapier 1d6 18-20 x2
Great Axe 20 x3

Scimitar 1d6 18-20 x2
Halberd 1d10 20 x3

The weapons with the high critical ranges need criticals just to be on average equaling the heavily less acurate weapons. So increasing a hgih critical range weapon is like spending alot of feats jsut to match the basic hard hittign weapon.

Also you shouldn't look at it as its to powerful because, plainly put, as you focu more on a weapon your skill improves. If a player is limiting is combat performance to a specific path, you shouldn't punnish him for it, by making hsi one strogn path weak. Because his combat skills will be lacking in other areas.

Don't forget you could jsut use, Oozes, Constructs and Undead. Those type of encoutners will slow that high critical range guy down.

 

[Geoff Watson]

Keen and Improved Crit are only overpowered if the weapon has some super special ability that works on criticals (eg Vorpal, or Mind Feeder).

In general, they aren't that great. An extra +1 enhancement is nearly always better than Keen.

Taren, your house rule makes them the same for the 'crit on 20', and worse for the other weapons.

Geoff.

 

[Crothian]

Personally, I really like the Improved Critical Feat and Keen magical ability. It adds a little bit of exctment to the comabt as characters really like to try to get criticals.

 

[Avatar of the North]

Geoff Watson- according to the sage weapons with propertise the vorpal only opperate when in the weapons 'natural' threat range, not the effectie threat range from keen/improved crit.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

But this is nowhere stated in the rule books, so its an errata. And not everybody uses or even knows the errata.

(Instead of using this method, I would give Vorpal a Fortitude Saving Throw, success means "just" extra damage)

Mustrum Ridcully

 

[Geoff Watson]

Geoff Watson- according to the sage weapons with propertise the vorpal only opperate when in the weapons 'natural' threat range, not the effectie threat range from keen/improved crit.

Where did he say this?
I remember Monte Cook saying that it was a house rule he was thinking of using, but I don't remember seeing it in Sage Advice or the FAQ.

Geoff.