D&D (2024) Do you plan to adopt D&D5.5One2024Redux?

[James Gasik]

Why? You literally tailor-made everything for their backgrounds to count! Why nerf it?

If it really bugs you, just remember that you said everything is available for a price. The nobles will only grant an audience to people who give them impressive gifts. The librarians make a pointed glance at the donation box each time the player asks a question or wants to see a book, or a membership fee in order to get into the restricted section. The ship will take them after they make some repairs, but that takes time since they don't have the gold to expedite those repairs, hint hint.

Or just have a completely unrelated adventure ready for times just like this. One sorcerer sending assassins after another one (and the one they're being sent to also happens to be the one the PC is going to), monsters wandering the streets at night, a sorcerer testing out an illicit spell on the unwitting populace, something like that.

Woah there, this isn't me personally doing this. It's just how I've seen backgrounds occur. DM's will forget they exist and be surprised when they come up.

It's not what should be happening with backgrounds, but it's what I've seen happen in actual play. Ideally, the DM should always be aware of the backgrounds the players have and try to work them into the game so they are relevant more often, but that can be extra work, and adventuring doesn't always let things like being a sailor be relevant as a matter of course.

In many games, it just happens that the DM might just legitimately forget. The players too. And then it can be a surprise when it does come up, and well, most DM's I've encountered don't always react well to surprises. It's a thing.

I have a Wizard who knows Mending as part of their backstory. Mending isn't a very useful cantrip. When it actually came up in a session, the DM was like "let me read that", and then ruled that Mending was useless in the situation (which to be fair, it's a pretty limited cantrip).

I have seen Backgrounds end up just that way- the little used, oft-forgotten ability that the DM could have planned for, but didn't, and so when it came up, it's a nothingburger.

I don't see that as bad DMing, it's just the reality of the situation that some abilities are just too niche for the game to always support unless the DM goes out of their way to make the magic happen, and they got a lot of other stuff to worry about, especially in a game where combat, something Backgrounds aren't usually relevant for, is such a large part of the game.

 

[mamba]

I don't know what you mean by "change the world".

that is too bad, because I explained it in the text you quoted

It's a joke to say a player can decide what their PC thinks as long as they're okay with the DM deciding their PC is delusional.

no, it is a fact, just because your character thinks something does not make it true, as I said they are either correct or mistaken

Because only an insane person can have knowledge of ship routes on other planes?

a plane you never have been to, upon arrival? pretty much, you can find out about them, but you cannot just spout them out with no prior knowledge, that should be self-explanatory

 

[mamba]

I don't think @Faolyn or @Hriston was ever advocating for this sort of play.

I think @Hriston very much is, or he does an awful job of drawing a distinction

 

[Faolyn]

Woah there, this isn't me personally doing this. It's just how I've seen backgrounds occur. DM's will forget they exist and be surprised when they come up.

Sorry; that was meant to be more of a "generic you" thing but I went too much.

 

[Maxperson]

So to get rid of the cop out (you do like those..) of ‘every world is different, so I ignore it in my answer’, let’s go with the Ravenloft as described by me. Vistani can travel the mists, but they have no control over where they end up, and they always end up in a different domain within Ravenloft.

Not trying to derail the conversation, but is this a lore change or a typo? The Vistani were the only ones who could travel the mists and control where they ended up. Anyone could go in and not control the outcome.

 

[mamba]

Not trying to derail the conversation, but is this a lore change or a typo? The Vistani were the only ones who could travel the mists and control where they ended up. Anyone could go in and not control the outcome.

oops, doesn’t really make a difference as long as they have to stay in Ravenloft though

 

[James Gasik]

Sorry; that was meant to be more of a "generic you" thing but I went too much.

Oh sorry myself, it happens. But yeah, I get it, a lot of times a DM is their own worst enemy. "Wait, that's too easy, I wanted that to be a thing!" Without realizing that sometimes things should be easy. Like the guy who revises monster hit points when a player gets a lucky crit, thinking they're keeping the game fun by not letting things become too easy, instead of thinking "hey wait, I can use this...they get to have their moment of glory, but now this guy's bosses' bosses' boss will be wondering what the hold up is with his master plan...or hm, maybe this guy is a simulacrum, so he went down easy...."

 

[Lanefan]

Prove it.

Prove what?

That players will, if given leeway to do things by written rules the wording of which guarantees those things will succeed, quite reasonably expect to be able to do those things - even when doing those things blows up believability and-or consistency? I don't see any need to prove this is a problem, if only because it's so blindingly obvious.

Or that a DM should ideally be finding and fixing problems with the rules before they arise rather than after? No proof required: the DM is objectively at least trying to do it right, and make the game work better.

 

[Lanefan]

What I would do is, if the player said "I want to find a ship to sail on and use my background to help me do so," I'd say something like, "how are you doing this?"

What if the player just says "My background says I can find a ship, so now we have a ship. Let's go!".

Because as worded, the player has the backing of the rules in saying just this.

And don't get me wrong, I'm with you in that I'd want this role-played out. My point is that the rules themselves are in this case flat-out faulty, and give players unreasonable expectations that it's then on the DM to blunt or deny.

 

[Hussar]

What if the player just says "My background says I can find a ship, so now we have a ship. Let's go!".

Because as worded, the player has the backing of the rules in saying just this.

And don't get me wrong, I'm with you in that I'd want this role-played out. My point is that the rules themselves are in this case flat-out faulty, and give players unreasonable expectations that it's then on the DM to blunt or deny.

I gotta admit, as a player that’s generally my reaction to DMs who do this. How do I do it? I don’t know. I don’t care either. I just do it, stop trying to monkey’s paw things and get to the results.

The how is completely uninteresting and only being done so you can say no/nerf the idea/throw roadblocks up so I have to faff about for the next X amount of time until I satisfy your sense of “challenge”.

I took the background specifically so I don’t have to do this. It just gets done.

If you’re not going to allow it, just tell me that and quit wasting my time. If you are going to allow it, then quit wasting g my time and let’s go. In either case, quit wasting my time.