Another Stealth Question (KotS spoiler)

[Infiniti2000]

The PC's are going down a staircase into a well-lit room. A guard has a clear view of the staircase. Can the rogue (more than 10 squares ahead) use stealth to sneak up on the guard? Obviously, the rogue can use stealth prior to moving down the stairs, so does he remain stealthy once in the room or nearly in the room? Maybe until such a time as he has no more "corner" (actually the corner of the ceiling as he goes down) to hide behind?

KotS spoiler part:

Spoiler

I would say no, based on the rules (using the errata), but KotS for the first guard room in the keep itself mentions that the PC's must succeed on a DC 13 Stealth check. Granted, this module came out before the core rules, so maybe it's just a mistake. But, I wanted to ask hoping someone could shed some light.

Thanks!

 

[Mengu]

It's up to the DM... I'd look at the light sources in the room. If there are torches that might cast shadows alongside one wall of the hallway, then, yes a stealth check could be made up to the threshold of the room (or beginning of shadows whereever you decide that to be). Once in the room (or beyond the shadows), the rogue would be seen. However there is nothing stopping the rogue from firing a crossbow from the threshold.

 

[Black Knight Irios]

IIRC, if you are hidden and you don't have cover/concealment at the end of a (move) action you are no longer hidden.

The room is well-lit so no concealment. It is the end of the stairs and if you use the standard encounter write up the rogue would have no cover. So he would be no longer hidden.

 

[TheGogmagog]

If the opponents are alert: Fresh on guard or forewarned or in the midst of combat, then you can't hide without concealment.

If they are 'otherwise distracted' out of combat then it's DM's call. It could be the same or you would be up against their passive perception (apparently), along with any modifiers the DM may deem important. Perhaps the room may be full of clutter or distracting wall decoration (although shown as an empty room as far as combat and movement is concerned). Perhaps they are talking about something intense or just don't like their boss/job much. In this case the module listed a DC so they wern't alert.

Might be a spoiler, but I'm curious if they suggest what that DC got you, to the bottom of the stairs, up to something of cover in the room, along the walls of the room, 5 squares away from them, right up adjacent to 'behind' them. I wouldn't have even thought of attempting this with our regular DM, but have had DM's that would entertain the idea of sneaking adjacent to a target in the right conditions.

 

[brendan candries]

IIRC, if you are hidden and you don't have cover/concealment at the end of a (move) action you are no longer hidden.

That only works if you have Shadow Stride (Rogue Utility 10) and this works for cover only, otherwise you need cover/concealment at all times during your movement.

On the other hand, if you loose your hidden status due to an action, you still benefit from the hidden status until that action is resolved.

Combat advantage is the only benefit I'm sure of that you retain during that action (e.g. Deft Strike). Not sure about other benefits.

 

[Starglim]

The PC's are going down a staircase into a well-lit room. A guard has a clear view of the staircase. Can the rogue (more than 10 squares ahead) use stealth to sneak up on the guard? Obviously, the rogue can use stealth prior to moving down the stairs, so does he remain stealthy once in the room or nearly in the room? Maybe until such a time as he has no more "corner" (actually the corner of the ceiling as he goes down) to hide behind?

As updated and as Brendan mentioned, at any point where the rogue has no cover or concealment, he is no longer hidden, unless he uses a power that says otherwise. If he is not hidden, enemies see him. He can complete his action with the benefit of being hidden (for example, to gain a sneak attack).

 

[rowport]

As updated and as Brendan mentioned, at any point where the rogue has no cover or concealment, he is no longer hidden, unless he uses a power that says otherwise. If he is not hidden, enemies see him. He can complete his action with the benefit of being hidden (for example, to gain a sneak attack).

This is how our group plays this. For clarification, you hide using Stealth with total cover/full concealment, and can move while staying hidden as long as you have cover/concealment (not requiring total cover/full concealment). Without any cover/concealment enemies will see you and you are no longer hidden. I mention this to highlight the difference between needing total cover/full concealment to BECOME hidden versus only needing
cover/concealment to REMAIN hidden.

 

[Vegepygmy]

He can complete his action with the benefit of being hidden (for example, to gain a sneak attack).

Just to clarify: he retains the benefit of being hidden until he completes his action, not his turn, so if he moves out of hiding (move action) and wants to make a sneak attack (standard action), he's no longer hidden when he attacks. But if he's using some kind of power that lets him move and attack in the same action, he'll still be hidden when he attacks.

 

[Infiniti2000]

Okay, thanks everyone. I ran the encounter slightly incorrectly, but not enough to make a difference. I disallowed the sneaking and so we simply rolled initiative. I should've allowed a surprise round for the rogue or he could withdraw prior to being seen so as to report back to the party. Note that he was sneaking up prior to the encounter, so we were not yet in rounds.

 

[brendan candries]

Shadow Stride

Btw, Shadow Stride is changed in the last errata Version 4 (1/09).

http://www.wizards.com/dnd/files/UpdatePH.pdf

Brendan.