D&D (2024) Do you plan to adopt D&D5.5One2024Redux?

[Hriston]

More or less, it also says that you know the local ones, but yes, if you are somewhere unfamiliar and do not know a messenger there, then you cannot get a message to your contact

If you know the local messengers, then how do you not know a messenger there unless you're in a place with no local messengers?

It’s right there in the feature description “specifically, you know the local messengers, corrupt caravan masters, and seedy sailors who can deliver messages for you.”

That is specifically how you get the message to your contact, you cannot just hand it off to anyone or put it in a bottle and throw it in the ocean.
You can possibly get to learn about new messengers in the area you are in, but there might simply not be any as well, depends on the scenario

If there are messengers, you know them. If you're in a special place with no messengers, then you ought to know that too.

same as me,

No, your reading of this is not the same. The feature states your character knows "how to get messages to and from your contact, even over great distances" and goes on to elaborate on what this knowledge consists of, i.e. "the local messengers, corrupt caravan masters, and seedy sailors who can deliver messages for you." So it works like this: You're in a place with messengers and need to correspond with your contact? Bingo! You know them.

if this is the how, then what do you do in an area where you know no messengers?

Does such an area not exist?

No, such an area would be either one that has no local messengers or one where it doesn't come up because you have no need to correspond with your contact.

If so, that means that you do know all the messengers, everywhere in the world and across all planes, and there are some everywhere, just to ensure that you can always reach your contact… or does local maybe mean the ones in the area you grew up in / start out in… I know which of the two I consider more feasible…

Since that's not the case, there's no need to worry about any of this.

 

[mamba]

If you know the local messengers, then how do you not know a messenger there unless you're in a place with no local messengers?

we are going in circles, I answered that days ago

You know local messengers where you are local to, not everywhere on all planes, as that would require one of two things, and both are nonsensical

That means you know the local messengers wherever you happen to be. That either means 1) you know all messengers there are, all across all the worlds and planes and 2) they exist all across the world and planes to ensure there always are local messengers or 3) you know a handful or so of messengers and miraculously one of those is always wherever you find yourself

Neither of which really makes any sense when you think about it, so I go with local means the ones where you grew up / start out in

No, your reading of this is not the same.

agreed, it is not, mine makes sense and yours does not

The feature states your character knows "how to get messages to and from your contact, even over great distances" and goes on to elaborate on what this knowledge consists of, i.e. "the local messengers, corrupt caravan masters, and seedy sailors who can deliver messages for you." So it works like this: You're in a place with messengers and need to correspond with your contact? Bingo! You know them.

I wholeheartedly disagree, 'know' means you already know the person, you are talking about 'recognize' or something. and that is not what is being described here "specifically, you know the local messengers"

You even used 'know' in the same sense as me to demonstrate that the chars could know a messenger just a few posts (and not even an hour) ago...

That doesn't mean it follows. I've never been to Spain, but I know someone who lives in Barcelona. That's a fact.

so which is it.... I guess it simply is whatever you think helps your case at the moment....

 

[Hriston]

no, but unless you have some explicitly established evidence that you have a viable reason to already know someone on some other plane of existence that you have not spent the vast majority if not the entirity of your life growing up on i will be unwilling to manifest someone there who just so happens to know you purely for indulging your background feature working.

Considering this is fiction we're talking about, what sort of evidence do you have in mind?

 

[Hriston]

yeah, not sure why you always go back, because I addressed that since…

I'm not going back. I'm just a week behind on my replies.

That means you know the local messengers wherever you happen to be.

Well, wherever you happen to be when you use the feature.

That either means 1) you know all messengers there are, all across all the worlds and planes and 2) they exist all across the world and planes to ensure there always are local messengers or 3) you know a handful or so of messengers and miraculously one of those is always wherever you find yourself

Neither of which really makes any sense when you think about it, so I go with local means the ones where you grew up / start out in

You missed 4) you know messengers in places where you actually use the feature to send or receive messages using the messengers who exist in those places. I think that makes sense.

 

[mamba]

I'm not going back. I'm just a week behind on my replies.

looking forward to more replies in the near future then

Well, wherever you happen to be when you use the feature.

I disagree with that...

You missed 4) you know messengers in places where you actually use the feature to send or receive messages using the messengers who exist in those places. I think that makes sense.

it makes zero sense as that is the same as knowing them everywhere since there is no limitation here. So this not any more realistic / probable than that, i.e. not at all

 

[CreamCloud0]

Considering this is fiction we're talking about, what sort of evidence do you have in mind?

An existing character trait like species or subclass, GM acknowledged backstory events or the events of the campaign itself.

 

[Hussar]

put me in a bad enough mood that if the DM had been the kind who said they would do it all by RAW that I would take it as a challenge and seen how far out I could go

Hrm... why is no one picking you up for "challenging the DM"?

But, no. Ridiculous examples are ridiculous. I mean, good grief, we have examples IN THIS THREAD of DM's doing exactly what I am talking about, yet, not a single example of a player taking things to the degree you are talking about.

But, sure, take it as a win? I guess?

 

[Hussar]

Your post is well written and feel I understand your point.

My only question is how do you know which NPCs don't matter?


I can give a concrete example from our point of view.

Characters needed to get to some desert ruins (long journey).
Most of the trip would be by river.
There were five ships available.
Three were generic NPCs.
One was a merchant lord that wanted in on the adventure, for money, profit, and influence.
The last one was a spy for the ruling class of wizards in the area (wanted to steal everything).


They talked to them and unknowingly chose the spy.

Was a great adventure (details too long for this example.

So, if I'm understanding this right, the entire plotline, created by the DM, centered around a 20% chance of actually occurring? That 4 out of 5 times, you "great adventure" wouldn't actually happen?

Not sure if I want to DM that way.

 

[SkidAce]

So, if I'm understanding this right, the entire plotline, created by the DM, centered around a 20% chance of actually occurring? That 4 out of 5 times, you "great adventure" wouldn't actually happen?

Not sure if I want to DM that way.

No, they choose one of the 5 available paths, all were ready for play. If they had chosen a 6th option, as I do not constrain their actions, then I would have had to improvise.

 

[Hussar]

Weird. I meant to quote @Hussar, and thought that I had. The strangest part, is that I even looked at his specific wording when writing that reply. If I was somehow quoting you, how did I even do that?

Heh. I gotta admit, that one threw me too.