Griffith Dragonlake
First Post
If Elves can breed with Humans, and Orcs can breed with Humans then why not Elves and Orcs? Why no Elveorcs or Orcelves? I should think an Orc/Drow combination quite potent.
Why no Half-elf/Half-orcs?
- Thread starter Griffith Dragonlake
- Start date
Lanefan
Victoria Rules
I asked myself this many years ago, the answer ultimately leading to generation of a huge chart of what could in theory breed with what. Believe me, it gets messy once you consider things like gods, shapeshifters, dragons, the various half-human creatures e.g. Centaurs, Lamia, etc., and so on.......
Lanefan
Lanefan
Drowbane
First Post
Severe racial hatred. Assuming the view that current Half-Elves happen due to "frowned upon by both races" relationships and that Half-Orcs usually come from rape... and that Elves and Orcs have always hated each other as long as they've been in D&D.
A child born from an orc raping an elf (I just can't see it happening the other way around) would likely be put out of its misery quickly.
And a child born from a drow having its way with an orc slave (I just can't see it happening the other way around
) would be sacrificed just as quickly to Lloth (or Lolth, if you prefer).
Now, in a campaign where the above is not assumed to be true... sure... why not?
But, its not for me. (I don't acknowledge half-orcs either).
A child born from an orc raping an elf (I just can't see it happening the other way around) would likely be put out of its misery quickly.
And a child born from a drow having its way with an orc slave (I just can't see it happening the other way around
) would be sacrificed just as quickly to Lloth (or Lolth, if you prefer).Now, in a campaign where the above is not assumed to be true... sure... why not?
But, its not for me. (I don't acknowledge half-orcs either).
Kae'Yoss
First Post
I think it was at some time written in some D&D books that they could not interbreed because their respective gods (or at least the elven ones) made it impossible....
....and then there's this part...
...I wonder why the same wasn't always applied to half-orcs (orc/humans): I'd say that they're usually the result of rape, too, and humans are probably not that much friendlier towards orcs than elves. So a human mother (or her family, neighbours and so on) would probably act the same.
As for half-orcs born from orc parents, I assume that most wouldn't survive that long, because they're weak.
I'd also think that they wouldn't stoop to that. Drow are usually described as very racist, and vain, and orcs are usually filthy and ugly.
I think that in the end, they just didn't want to make a half- template for every single race out there, or have huge charts where you could look up your race by determining what his parents and grandparents were and get your racial traits from that. Messy business. Plus, I guess it's to foil powergamers (but then again, dwarves are a standard race...)
I want to point out that Midnight has something similar. Not orcs and elves, but orcs and dwarves. All of them the result of atrocities (because those races hate each other with a passion). They're Eredane's physically most imposing race (dwarven toughness combined with orcish strength), probably the most miserable creatures in the whole world, and the only creatures that hate orcs more than dwarves do.
They're invariably outcasts (those who aren't killed at childbirth, of course), and invariably live with the Kurgans (outcast dwarves that live on the surface). Non-outcast dwarves don't want them around not least because they seem to be living proof that orcs and dwarves are related more closely than dwarves would ever want to admit.
So if you really want orc/elf crossbreeds, you might want to do something similar
Drowbane said:
....and then there's this part...
...I wonder why the same wasn't always applied to half-orcs (orc/humans): I'd say that they're usually the result of rape, too, and humans are probably not that much friendlier towards orcs than elves. So a human mother (or her family, neighbours and so on) would probably act the same.
As for half-orcs born from orc parents, I assume that most wouldn't survive that long, because they're weak.
And a child born from a drow having its way with an orc slave (I just can't see it happening the other way around
I'd also think that they wouldn't stoop to that. Drow are usually described as very racist, and vain, and orcs are usually filthy and ugly.
I think that in the end, they just didn't want to make a half- template for every single race out there, or have huge charts where you could look up your race by determining what his parents and grandparents were and get your racial traits from that. Messy business. Plus, I guess it's to foil powergamers (but then again, dwarves are a standard race...)
I want to point out that Midnight has something similar. Not orcs and elves, but orcs and dwarves. All of them the result of atrocities (because those races hate each other with a passion). They're Eredane's physically most imposing race (dwarven toughness combined with orcish strength), probably the most miserable creatures in the whole world, and the only creatures that hate orcs more than dwarves do.
They're invariably outcasts (those who aren't killed at childbirth, of course), and invariably live with the Kurgans (outcast dwarves that live on the surface). Non-outcast dwarves don't want them around not least because they seem to be living proof that orcs and dwarves are related more closely than dwarves would ever want to admit.
So if you really want orc/elf crossbreeds, you might want to do something similar
an_idol_mind
Explorer
The explanation for my setting is that elves and orcs are too distant from each other. Humans are a middle ground, distantly related to both species -- they're sort of a missing link between orcs and elves.
That said, if a PC really wanted to play an Elforc, I'd probably allow it. My guess is that the real reason they've never been mentioned in a D&D supplement is that no one feels like playing one.
That said, if a PC really wanted to play an Elforc, I'd probably allow it. My guess is that the real reason they've never been mentioned in a D&D supplement is that no one feels like playing one.
Jürgen Hubert
First Post
They might exist, though it should be noted that elves tend to have such small populations in most settings when compared to humans and orcs that this is a much more unlikely combination than half human, half orc.
Of course, whether such a combination is even possible depends on how the local equivalent of genetics work. Maybe it's impossible - humans might be genetically closer to both elves and orcs than elves and orcs are to each other.
Personally, when it comes to "fantasy genetics", I rather like the assumptions of Exalted where almost anything can breed with anything under the right circumstances. Described are offspring of:
- Humans and gods.
- Humans and demons.
- Humans and ghosts - in this case the mother needs to be a living human, though the ghostly parent may be either male or female.
- Humans and elementals.
- Humans and Fair Folk.
- Humans and animals - this requires the presence of Wyld (=chaos) energies, though there's rather a lot of that at the edges of the world. Some powerful humans who have been invested with the power of a particular god (Lunars, if you know the setting) and who can transform into animal shapes have even used this to breed servant races of beastmen.
- Animals and inanimate objects: This requires even more Wyld energies. One of the sourcebook describes a "stone lion" - the offspring of a lion and a stone. I thought that was pretty cool...
Of course, whether such a combination is even possible depends on how the local equivalent of genetics work. Maybe it's impossible - humans might be genetically closer to both elves and orcs than elves and orcs are to each other.
Personally, when it comes to "fantasy genetics", I rather like the assumptions of Exalted where almost anything can breed with anything under the right circumstances. Described are offspring of:
- Humans and gods.
- Humans and demons.
- Humans and ghosts - in this case the mother needs to be a living human, though the ghostly parent may be either male or female.
- Humans and elementals.
- Humans and Fair Folk.
- Humans and animals - this requires the presence of Wyld (=chaos) energies, though there's rather a lot of that at the edges of the world. Some powerful humans who have been invested with the power of a particular god (Lunars, if you know the setting) and who can transform into animal shapes have even used this to breed servant races of beastmen.
- Animals and inanimate objects: This requires even more Wyld energies. One of the sourcebook describes a "stone lion" - the offspring of a lion and a stone. I thought that was pretty cool...
the Jester
Legend
Here is your answer.
1st edition Monster Manual- Orc said:
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