Why it was called "Dungeons & Dragons 3e"

[JohnSnow]

So, I had a thought a while back that I wanted to share with the community.

It occurred to me after pondering the edition numbering for years that 3e was the game's 3rd-Edition in a lot of different ways.

First and most obviously, it was the successor to AD&D and AD&D: 2nd-Edition. That makes logical sense, and I think people mostly stop there and don't ponder the rest.

But it's also the "Third Edition" in a few other ways. Follow along with me if you will...

Way back in the bygone days of 1974, there was one "D&D," the original, or "White Box" game. In many ways, this was the first iteration (1st-Edition) before the game "split." The Holmes box was basically the same game. This continued until the late-70s, when the game split into two separate product lines: the boxed-set Moldvay "Basic/Expert Dungeons & Dragons" line and the hardcover "Advanced Dungeons & Dragons" line.

So, counting this way, OD&D/Holmes was the game's "1st-Edition," and the successive split into two product lines is the game's "Second Edition." The reintegration becomes 3e.

But you can take it even further, where the Basic/Expert Moldvay boxed sets (which were retooled by Mentzer) is the 1st Edition of "Dungeons and Dragons," (just like the 1e AD&D books are that game's "1st-Edition") and the expanded "Rules Cyclopedia" is the 2nd-Edition of THAT game.

Which makes 3e the successor to both. And explains why they dropped the "Advanced" name.

Anyway, I doubt WotC put that much thought into it, but I was woolgathering and thought it was an interesting observation.

 

[A2Z]

Anyway, I doubt WotC put that much thought into it, but I was woolgathering and thought it was an interesting observation.

I think they absolutely put that much thought into. I'm pretty sure one of the Dragon magazine previews back in the day mentioned this.

 

[JohnSnow]

I think they absolutely put that much thought into. I'm pretty sure one of the Dragon magazine previews back in the day mentioned this.

Funny, maybe I was half-remembering one of those old articles. I think I still have those issues laying about.

Perhaps I should go check.

 

[Twiggly the Gnome]

I think the thought was that it was the successor to the AD&D line, and since the the need to contrast it to the by then moribund D&D (BECMI/Cyclopedia) line no longer existed, they dropped the Advanced adjective.

 

[billd91]

I think the thought was that it was the successor to the AD&D line, and since the the need to contrast it to the by then moribund D&D (BECMI/Cyclopedia) line no longer existed, they dropped the Advanced adjective.

Dropping the Advanced term for 3e was intended to reunify the branding from the divergent branches back into a single game identity. I think once WotC inherited the game, they'd have done the same whether either 2e or BECMI were moribund or not.

 

[Mark Hope]

You'll be claiming the numbering of the Rambo movies makes sense next.

 

[GMMichael]

So, counting this way, OD&D/Holmes was the game's "1st-Edition," and the successive split into two product lines is the game's "Second Edition." The reintegration becomes 3e.

Reintegration? You might say they made it One D&D.

Which makes 3e the successor to both. And explains why they dropped the "Advanced" name.

My PHB printing didn't mention being a "3rd edition" (that a browse would reveal). But "new edition" is an important idea to throw around when you're trying to sell D&D books that aren't by TSR, I guess. Funny how that's not the case for this year's new edition.

 

[FitzTheRuke]

That's not bad - if you see OD&D as 1st, and AD&D (both 1e & 2e) as 2nd, then 3.0 & 3.5 are 3rd, 4e is 4th, and 5e 2014 & 5e 2024 are 5th. It's just that the term Edition is referring to Eras rather than, you know, actual editions of core books.

Because if we did the latter, we'd be at, IIRC, 16th Edition, or something like that.

It honestly makes more sense than what we've got.

 

[Man in the Funny Hat]

• In the beginning in 1974 there was only D&D. There was no confusing editions or how they were or weren't numbered.
• In 1977 there was a version of D&D rules authored by J Eric Holmes. It was done WHILE the AD&D rules were still being put together, but deemed a good idea. It was intended to be an introduction to the D&D game, would cover only the first 3 PC levels and while there were differences, for all practical intents and purposes was otherwise the same as the original game. It was also gathered into ONE book instead of 3 booklets. There was still no confusion because it was now being called the Basic Set of rules, and it referred players looking to advance BEYOND 3rd level to look to the Advanced rules (which weren't even out yet).
• Later that year (still 1977) the first book of Advanced Dungeons & Dragons rules (no numbering, still just "advanced") was released - it was the Monster Manual. Lots of monsters for people to use in their D&D games, but they were otherwise still operating on the original 3-booklet rules or the Holmes introductory "Basic" rules.
• In 1978 came the Advanced D&D Players Handbook (PH). The "advanced" rules were finally being really seen, but they still weren't complete yet. Anybody using any portions of the MM or PH still was likely using the original D&D rules, or the introductory Holmes rules (or even the precursor Chainmail rules) as part of their D&D games. There was now SOME inevitable confusion because AD&D rules were significantly bulkier and different from what had been seen up to that point. But people still either mostly stuck to Original D&D/Holmes rules and left the Advanced rules out of it, or they based their games more heavily (if not entirely) on the Advanced rules, possibly with some rules still seeing use from previous releases. If you used the "Advanced" books you called your game Advanced D&D or AD&D. If you didn't use "Advanced" rules books, you still called your game just D&D, not "advanced" anything nor AD&D.
• In 1979, the Dungeon Masters Guide completed the release of the Advanced set of rules. Now you almost certainly saw a split. Some people didn't like the Advanced game rules, not everybody SAW them or knew they existed - and the Basic Set rules were still being sold! That meant confusion, but it was still not numbered anything - it was either Basic D&D, or Advanced D&D, depending on the books you chose to use/not use.
• In 1981 came another revision of the Basic rules, but they didn't end advancement with 3rd level characters, nor refer anyone to AD&D - Basic Rules became ENTIRELY its own thing. There were additions of more books for Basic and eventually all collated into a single volume, but also at some point there was a feud between Gary Gygax and Dave Arneson over who should be credited with what and therefore PAID for what. That resulted in Arneson's name being attached more permanently with the Basic Rules and Gygax's name being attached to the Advanced Rules.
• In 1989 came the SECOND edition of the ADVANCED rules. This is where confusion REALLY begins. To distinguish between the Second Edition AD&D rules, the rules formerly known simply as "Advanced Dungeons & Dragons" became known as FIRST Edition AD&D. Meanwhile Basic D&D was still off doing its own thing quite separate from First or Second Edition AD&D.
• Then one day TSR died a (quite well-deserved IMO) corporate death. D&D OF ANY KIND ceased to effectively be published. Wizards of the Coast bought TSR and all of it's stuff, good and bad. They rescued D&D from oblivion. For a few years they mostly sold TSR products that they still had in stock, and completed some projects that were close to done and sold those too, but meanwhile they were working on an entirely new edition of D&D. They then ended the whacky notion of having two different versions of D&D rules being sold at the same time. They chose to name the new edition the THIRD Edition. It wasn't really a continued development of ANY previous edition. Ask anyone if 3E is a continuation of OD&D or Basic D&D - they'll laugh at you. Ask anyone if 3E is a continuation of Advanced D&D (either 1E AD&D or 2E AD&D) and they laugh just as loud. It wasn't a continuation of either in any practical perspective. That was all history now. From that point it was just D&D, and the version of rules was called the Third Edition. If you like, you could think of it as Original/Basic D&D being the First Edition, Advanced and then 2nd Edition Advanced being collectively the Second Edition (since 2E AD&D was very, VERY similar to "1E" AD&D), and then Third Edition was a completely new branch independent of either of those.

 

[Jack Daniel]

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