Whats the point of monkey grip?

[Question]

Most PCs are medium sized. Using a large great sword jumps the damage from 2d6 to 2d8 or 2-12 to 2-16 damage, on average a 2 point damage increase.

With monkey grip that is a -2 penalty to attacks. With power attack you could subtract 2 points from your BAB and gain +4 damage, on average twice as good as simply using monkey grip.

The only way this breaks even is using exotic weapon proficiency and a fullblade, but that only breaks even, and uses 2 feats for something you can do with power attack.

Is it just me or is this feat only useful for PCs that are at least large sized?

 

[3d6]

A Huge greatsword deals 4d6 points of damage, which means that it isn't worth it for a Large character either. You only get +1d6 damage for your -2 to attack rolls.

If you're Huge, though, you can go from weilding a 4d6 damage greatsword to weilding a 6d6 damage greatsword, so it may be worth it for a Huge character.

 

[Viktyr Gehrig]

There's no real mechanical benefit. It's a style thing.

 

[frankthedm]

3.0 monkeygrip let you do this

It was part enough of the 3e look to get concept art.

 

[Bront]

Doesn't Monkey Grip let you use a large bastard sword one handed?

Mechanicaly, it's not that exciting, it's more a flavor thing. Personaly, I don't care for it.

 

[CrimsonWineGlass]

I use it, but like people stated before, its more for style. I tend to give up power in favor of style, but I also tend to play RP heavy games.

 

[Scharlata]

[...]Is it just me or is this feat only useful for PCs that are at least large sized?

Hi!

My Shackled City Dwarven Fighter began with a Monkey Gripped Large Dwarven Waraxe (2d8 damage) in one hand and a Heavy Shield in the other hand.

Maybe that's the way you should look for an answer?

http://de.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/sc...de.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/scharlata/my_photos
Enjoy!

 

[Lorehead]

Most PCs are medium sized. Using a large great sword jumps the damage from 2d6 to 2d8 or 2-12 to 2-16 damage, on average a 2 point damage increase.

This is incorrect. A Large greatsword deals 3d6 base damage, on average a 3.5 point increase before factoring in crits (PH 114). This is slightly worse than the same character could do simply by Power Attacking for two points of damage.

This would be a better deal for a sword-and-board fighter. A Large longsword deals 2d6 points of damage instead of 1d8, a 2.5 point increase, which is significantly more than the same character could get with Power Attack. A Large bastard sword is even better at 2d8 points of damage, a 3.5 point increase. Additionally, this damage increase can exceed the cap on Power Attack. If you frequently polymorph into a Large creature, it's convenient to have a Large weapon on hand.

Even this isn't especially useful: sword-and-board fighting is a poor choice if floaty shields are in play (to use Design & Development's nickname), or even if they aren't. You can choose how many points to put into Power Attack, but not to stop using Monkey Grip if your primary weapon is Large, or to alter the trade-off. Power Attack gives you much more flexibility, but the added value of Monkey Grip for a character who already has Power Attack is small or even negative.

Monkey Grip does have one legitimate use for a powergamer: it's a prerequisite for Wield Oversized Weapon (Complete Warrior 153). This epic feat removes the penalty. For greatsword users, it's still inferior to taking Epic Prowess twice and dropping the points into Power Attack, It's great, though, for dwarf two-weapon fighters: by combining weapon familiarity, Perfect Two-Weapon Fighting, Oversized Two-Weapon Fighting and Wield Oversized Weapon, they can wield dwarven waraxes in both hands, with -2/-2 on attack rolls, for 2d8 points of base damage plus bonus damage with both.

 

[Infiniti2000]

3.5 nerfed monkey grip. I had a 3.0 fighter who wielded a guisarme in one hand. Now, he could wield a Large guisarme in two hands, but not a Medium guisarme in one hand.

 

[Hypersmurf]

With monkey grip that is a -2 penalty to attacks. With power attack you could subtract 2 points from your BAB and gain +4 damage, on average twice as good as simply using monkey grip.

But don't forget, the Monkey-Gripper who also has Power Attack has a higher maximum damage than the pure Power Attacker. His average damage likely decreases, of course, but for the APAATT raging barbarian, it's just more of the same

The only way this breaks even is using exotic weapon proficiency and a fullblade...

Given that the Fullblade hasn't been reprinted for 3.5 anywhere, and given that the flavour text in 3E implied it was designed for Large creatures, I'd be inclined to call the 3E Fullblade a Large Bastard Sword under the 3.5 rules; it's almost identical to what the weapon was in 3E, with the exception of the new -2 for inappropriate size.

-Hyp.