What are the characteristics of a swashbuckler, in game terms?

[WizarDru]

In several threads now, the topic of the Swashbuckler, and how D&D poorly emulates/represents him, has come up. This begs the question, to me:

What is the Swashbuckler?

I don't mean Who is he, or what he's like conceptually, so much as in what regard the rules underserve him. The fighter, rogue and fighter/rogue are put forth as inadequate to the task, and I would agree, to some extent. But part of that is owed to the D&D abstract combat 'engine', if you will, and part of that is that many of the options provided for a swashbuckler are, IMHO, simply not there in D&D.

But, is this a question of a lack of combat options, a question of having a viable defense with little or no armor, or something else?

 

[diaglo]

watch Captain Courageous

he is a Fighting Man

in 1edADnD they made him a Race of Humans: The Buccaneer

in 2edADnD he was a Kit

in tur...3ed and 3.11ed for Workgroups he is a PrC.

 

[Voadam]

In several threads now, the topic of the Swashbuckler, and how D&D poorly emulates/represents him, has come up. This begs the question, to me:

What is the Swashbuckler?

I don't mean Who is he, or what he's like conceptually, so much as in what regard the rules underserve him. The fighter, rogue and fighter/rogue are put forth as inadequate to the task, and I would agree, to some extent. But part of that is owed to the D&D abstract combat 'engine', if you will, and part of that is that many of the options provided for a swashbuckler are, IMHO, simply not there in D&D.

But, is this a question of a lack of combat options, a question of having a viable defense with little or no armor, or something else?

Competent warrior with little armor and some dashing skills.

rogues fall down in hit points and BAB as do bards.

Fighters are optimized for tanking and lose a lot of class utility when they give up armor. They also fall down in the swashbukling repartee skills.

Multiclass fighter rogues work fairly well IMO only lacking in good AC. Unfettered work a litle better especially on AC.

 

[2d6]

Defense is an issue. He's also going to need to spend as much in non-combat skills as he does in martial skills.

beyond that, I think the class needs a setting that is condusive to role-play that character. I don't think the typical generic sitting is optimal for that kind of play.

 

[Henry]

My concept are a class that increases AC as it increases in levels, but starting with (all things being equal) an AC of 15 or so at first level.

Damage needs to be proportional to Dexterity rather than strength.

There needs to be a "plot bad luck" mechanic to represent his colossal penchant for getting into unique trouble.

Basically, for a class that is as dependant on Dexterity, as a barbarian is on strength.

Maybe I'll pass on some of these thoughts in a similarly titled House rules thread - or if Dru feels it more fitting, move this thread to house rules if the conversation goes that direction.

 

[alsih2o]

something to do with environmental ac and weaponry. chandeliers and hatracks.

 

[diaglo]

something to do with environmental ac and weaponry. chandeliers and hatracks.

and candelabras

 

[MEG Hal]

and candelabras

No, no no...that is the Liberace PrC

 

[takyris]

Random stuff...

I think that a fighter/rogue is fine, personally, although it'd be a tossup between fighter/rogue and fighter/bard for me. Anything that gives me more skill points, really. And I'd be going with more rogue or bard levels than fighter levels -- just a few fighter levels, to bring the ol' BAB up a bit. No more than 4 or so overall, but I'd take 'em early.

So, what are the characteristics of a hypothetical core Swashbuckler class?

- Well, Weapon Finesse would be an obvious one as a bonus feat.
- Some kind of class-based bonus to defense. Personally, I'd steal from the monk/duelist and twist it, going with Cha-bonus to defense. The swashbuckler is always faking people out and then shouting "Aha!" and trapping people's blades in a curtain or something. I'd also go for a class-based AC progression like the monk gets in addition to that Cha-bonus.
- Bonus feats along the following lines: Expertise, Improved Disarm, Dodge, Mobility, Spring Attack, Two-Weapon Fighting (and friends), etc.
- Class abilities along the following lines: Improvised weaponry or cover abilities, encouragement in unorthodox tactics(*), class-based ability to sacrifice attacks in order to parry incoming blows (which I dislike as a feat or basic ability), ability to negate opponent's strength bonus to attacks (critical for a swashbuckler fighting giants/ogres)

* - Unorthodox tactics are something I try to encourage. I tend to default it as a skill check of some sort, DC15, for a +2 bonus on something. Swinging on things is a Climb check, Sliding under or across things is a Balance check, Leaping is a jump check, and I'm open for using whichever one the player is best at and adding synergy bonus -- so a player with ranks in climb but not jump who wants to leap out, grab a pole, swing around it, and then fly back into somebody can use a Climb check, since he's grabbing the pole. The +2 ends up as a to-hit bonus most times, although my players use it for disarm or trip attempts as well. You do it with a charge, it ends up being pretty decent, and they're making more cinematic fights. And that +2 bonus is even part of the core rules for how to handle creative stuff, so it's not even a house rule on my part.

For the swashbuckler, I'd encourage this with some kind of arbitrary bonus. Make it a +3 instead of +2 when he does it, rising to +4 at mid-levels and +5 at high levels. The swashbuckler should be doing that stuff like a rogue sneak attacks, and it should be more than just flavor text.

 

[Henry]

Showman Pianist PrC

Level     BAB     Class Features
1          +0      Smile with those Pearly-Whites
2          +1      Look at camera while playing complex music
3          +1      Pretty as a Peacock
4          +2      Dual-wield Candelabras 
5          +2      Laugh All the Way to the Bank

I'll stop now.