Weapon Finesse and Touch Spells

[pingpong]

i was wondering if Weapon Finesse would cover the melee touch attack roll from spells like Shocking Grasp or Chill Touch, for example?

the only thing i could find is that you can make an unarmed attack when charged with a Touch spell, and deliver the spell in addition to any damage from the unarmed attack as a melee attack (not melee touch). and i know that unarmed attack is definitely covered by Weapon Finesse.

but, this isnt exactly what im going for. i was wondering if there was something im missing that would allow a spellcaster to just use the spell and get the benefit of Weapon Finesse without having to make it an unarmed attack.

im trying to weasel my way out of having to take Improved Unarmed Strike or have to eat the AoO. and i definitely want to weasel out of having to make a normal attack roll.

thanks

 

[jarlaxlecq]

i was wondering if Weapon Finesse would cover the melee touch attack roll from spells like Shocking Grasp or Chill Touch

I was actually wondering the same thing.

 

[Olgar Shiverstone]

A Touch spell is considered an armed attack, so you don't take an AoO for delivering it.

Since you can Finesse a natural attack, I see no reason you couldn't take Weapon Finesse and apply it when delivering a touch spell.

 

[Magic Missile]

This has me thinking of a somewhat related question.

Is it possible to use Weapon Focus with a touch attack? Would "Weapon Focus: Unarmed Strike" cover both actual unarmed strikes *and* touch attacks? Or would I specifically need "Weapon Focus: Touch Attacks"?

Hey, come to think of it, what about Weapon Specialization?

 

[Magic Slim]

Olgar covered the first question. As for your questions, Magic Missile... First of all, since a touch attack doesn't do damage, weapon specialization wouldn't do anything. It's the spell that does the damage, not the hand.

As for Weapon focus...My guess would be that it's ok. Reaching your opponent, be it to touch hit or hurt it with your hand, requires pretty much the same ability, so the feat would apply.

Slim

 

[Olgar Shiverstone]

IMO, WF:Unarmed Strike would cover touch attacks (though specialization would get you nothing unless you used an actual unarmed attack to deliver the spell, and not just a touch attack).

 

[Magic Missile]

Ah, the reason I ask is because AFAIK you *can* sneak attack with spells - so for instance, a sneak attack Shocking Grasp will deal extra d6's of electrical damage... I think? So I reasoned maybe Weapon Spec would just add +2 electrical damage.

Eh, not that the situation would ever come up. Just curious.

 

[Tellerve]

it wouldn't do +2 electrical, if it in fact did +2 which I wouldn't have in the first place. But IF you did the Wpn Spec, would be on the touch, which one day could be cold and then the next electricity, so I would reason the +2 wouldn't add elemental damage.

Essentially what I'm saying is no to the +2. You could specialize in IUS, however, to do the damage you have to make a normal attack role. The benefit of the touch attack being the obvious easier to hit versus the fact your not doing any damage from the attack (excepting the spell, and possible sneak 'cause you poke them in a vital spot with the lightning/cold/whatever)

Tellerve

 

[Sanackranib]

use the level 2 mage spell spectral hand for delivering all your touch spells and you will be much happier and live much longer