The Village of Hommlet has a built in TPK ending

[Quasqueton]

I just realized this while rereading my copy of The Village of Hommlet, by Gary Gygax: this adventure module has a built in TPK at the end. This adventure is for 1st-level characters, and novice Players. Looking through the encounters in this adventure, the PCs may, just *may*, reach 3rd level after defeating the BBEG (Lareth).

The very last paragraph of this module:

Note: If Lareth is slain, there will be inquiries in Hommlet---cautious and discreet inquiries---but the servants of evil there will make every attempt to find out what happened, and if any of the possessions of this cleric turn up, the slayers will be known, and an assassin of 10th level who can speak the alignment language of the major character of the group will come to the village within 3 weeks and proceed to attempt to eliminate the offenders. [Wow, what a run-on sentence that is.] As DM, you must handle this as you see fit. The cleric Terjon [6th level] and the Druid of the Grove [7th level] will certainly aid the persons so attacked. If the assassin is killed, nothing further will be attempted.

A 10th-level assassin, specially chosen for the assignment, against a party of probably 4-6 second- to third-level PCs is almost definitely a TPK, even with the potential help from a couple mid-level NPCs. Even if it is not a full TPK, some PCs *will* die.

That's harsh, Mr. Gygax, very harsh.

Quasqueton

 

[Morpheus]

Let's hope the party can keep their big mouths shut. If not, it's TPK time!

 

[Crothian]

And that's what should happen, nothing wrong with the PCs biting off more then they can chew and having the consiquences

 

[jester47]

Thats beautiful! Tell me does the Temple of Elemental Evil preserve this?

Aaron.

 

[sfedi]

I always saw the first modules as big crap.
With a lot of rail roading, and de-facto rules.

Gygax contributed to this trend a lot.

 

[Piratecat]

I always saw the first modules as big crap.
With a lot of rail roading, and de-facto rules.

Gygax contributed to this trend a lot.

In my opinion, you couldn't be more wrong. With the notable exception of the first Dragonlance modules, the first modules were the polar opposite of railroading*; they gave you a setting and a dungeon and you could wander hither and yon as you pleased.

It's also worth noting that when you're originating the rules, the claim of "defacto" is a bit disingenuous.

- Piratecat

* If you disregard the lame hooks for first getting you into G1-3. The modules give you a lot of freedom, but those hooks amount to "Do this or we'll kill you." That's a carryover from their use as convention modules.

 

[dvvega]

It is perfectly logical and within reason.

If no DM puts down consequences for offing an important BBEG and wandering around town carrying his equipment saying (insinuating by presence) "we took this mace <shakes Lareth's mace> and shoved it up his ... and then, we took his head and stuck it on a lance and put it on the moathouse, which is ours now" then he's basically just running a PC-kill everything with no consequence-fest.

Like that run on sentence?

If you look at a 10th level Assassin from first edition, he could still fail in the assassination attempt (wasn't 100%), so it wasn't a guaranteed kill of one character let alone the fact that there should be a party of 6-10 at least in the group. AD&D wasn't your "balanced for 4 players" game, it was "realistic, numbers win the day". Nowadays you have 6 players you up the EL by 2, back then, more characters meant easier kills, with maybe one dying.

The assassin in question would HAVE to kill each character individually since the first kill would get the party on his back if they were all in the room at the time. Once a member dies, they go to the church and Y'Dey resurrects them and then they "hang out together" until the assassin is found/killed or they leave town.

I have both played through and run T1 many times and there was never a TPK using AD&D rules.

sfedi's comments about the modules are misguided. There were no extra rules in the module, and there wasn't railroading except for the rumours table. If the party didn't pay attention to the rumours, the village could be used for a base of operations for other things. In fact one group I ran through it didn't want to go near the moathouse after the giant frogs attacked and so they went off and did other things. They returned to find the place cleared out and looted by another group.

 

[Eremite]

I always saw the first modules as big crap.
With a lot of rail roading, and de-facto rules.

Gygax contributed to this trend a lot.

Perhaps it's more accurate to say that ToEE was simply a rush job: it just didn't feel "finished".

I remember that, like a lot of EGG projects, it was several years overdue at the time it was published and, to me at least (*), it seemed to have been rushed together simply to ensure that it was indeed published. That also would explain why the nodes were left for the DM to finish himself....

I don't think "de-facto" is the word that you really mean: "ad hoc" would, IMO, better describe the 1E ruleset particularly by comparison to 3E/3.5E.

(*: At the risk of having a charge of heresy levied against me, I thought that ToEE was probably the worst of the "classic" 1E modules.)

 

[Altalazar]

Hey, it is just a nice dose of realism, as opposed to a world that somehow never seems to have anyone in it who is more than 2 CR or so higher than the party.

Roper, anyone?

 

[Sejs]

Lareth was a 5th level Cleric. Basically unless you're being very stealthy, the fight with him will involve 18 guardsmen (Fighter 1), 3 Sergeants (Fighter 2), the Lieutenant (Fighter 4) AND Lareth. Lareth with his friggin Staff of Striking, which had this annoying tendancy to mow thru people, what with that whole "3 charges, get tripple damage" thing.


Basically if your party can mow thru the fight and come out the other side intact enough to brag about it, then a single 10th level Assassin wouldn't prove an insurmountable challenge. He'll gank someone if he gets the drop on them, granted. But if he gets caught, he's stone busted.