D&D (2024) Planar Binding

[ptolemy]

I'm wondering how to use planer binding in the revised 5e rules as it seems that it isn't possible to actually bring creatures into you magic circle to bind. The summon spells don't summon a creature, right? They summon a spirit similar to a creature. But this isn't something planar binding works on, or is it? Is it expected that you go to the the elemental plane of air, find an elemental, beat it unconscious, drag it home, pop it in a magic circle and cast planar binding on it (I'm not necessarily against this, btw)? Or, maybe, I need to trick a priest into using planar ally and I can do something with that. Or is planar binding basically just a way of making the summoned spirits have a longer duration and that's it? Have I missed ways of calling creatures into my circle? Can I call an invisible stalker into my circle, bind it and send it with a valuable package across the ocean? Can I call a salamander and have it help me craft a sword? Is the intention to strip away all these uses for magic?

 

[SkidAce]

Use a Gate spell maybe?

Interesting. Could upend my entire custom devil sorcery class.

 

[MechaTarrasque]

You need a friend to use a summon monster spell, and as soon as the monster appears, you need to start the binding, because you can't concentrate on the summoned monster and cast a spell that takes longer than an action, as that takes concentration (see Longer Casting Times on page 236 of the 2024 PHB). That is a good deal, you get 23 hours of extra minion for the cost of one spell; sounds like it would be worth your buddy's 9th level slot to get the most out of the minion.

I think two casters could corral most outsiders they find on an adventure (and most adventures have at least one elemental, fiend, fey, or celestial in them). Caster 1 holds monster, caster 2 does the magic circle, and either of them can planar bind. Just remember that dispel magic was common in the at will or 3 times per day spell casting for demon lords and archdevils, so best to upcast the magic circle as high as you can.

Unless you are playing a one-shot, I wouldn't abuse planar ally. The best-case scenario is that the cleric's 6th level spell is now reduced to "summon mephit" or "summon dretch", because the god won't be happy with the cleric unless the cleric does something get back in the god's favor (want to guess which PC needs to die to make that happen?) or the god sends something to punish your PC (that was Plantar Angels' gig in 5e, and I wouldn't be shocked if it was now).

 

[SkidAce]

I'm wondering how to use planer binding in the revised 5e rules as it seems that it isn't possible to actually bring creatures into you magic circle to bind. The summon spells don't summon a creature, right? They summon a spirit similar to a creature. But this isn't something planar binding works on, or is it? Is it expected that you go to the the elemental plane of air, find an elemental, beat it unconscious, drag it home, pop it in a magic circle and cast planar binding on it (I'm not necessarily against this, btw)? Or, maybe, I need to trick a priest into using planar ally and I can do something with that. Or is planar binding basically just a way of making the summoned spirits have a longer duration and that's it? Have I missed ways of calling creatures into my circle? Can I call an invisible stalker into my circle, bind it and send it with a valuable package across the ocean? Can I call a salamander and have it help me craft a sword? Is the intention to strip away all these uses for magic?

The old legacy rules use the term "summon a spirit of" also.

Edit: Tasha's uses spirit on a quick glance, and Xanathar's uses "summon it" or "summon demon"

 

[SkidAce]

Text of 2024 Planar Binding states ("Typically, the creature is first summoned into the center of the inverted version of the Magic Circle spell to trap it while this spell is cast.)

So I think the intent is that summoning still works, and you bind the corporeal form of the "spirit" you sumoned.

 

[Henadic Theologian]

One way to do it is to cast the Summon spell, let's say summon celestial, and then use Wish or Greater Divine Intervention to cast Planar Binding as an action.

 

[ptolemy]

So the consensus appears to be that planar binding is just for the summoned spirits which come with the newer summon spells (unless you have access to Gate). So yes, it is merely a way of extending those spells and not a way of being creative in magic use. I’m terribly disappointed.

Thanks everyone for their comments.

 

[Charlaquin]

So the consensus appears to be that planar binding is just for the summoned spirits which come with the newer summon spells (unless you have access to Gate). So yes, it is merely a way of extending those spells and not a way of being creative in magic use. I’m terribly disappointed.

Thanks everyone for their comments.

I wouldn’t say it’s just a way of extending the summon spells. If you can keep any Crlestial, Elemental, Fey, or Fiend in range for the whole hour casting, there’s no reason it shouldn’t work. The summon spells are just the easiest way to get such a creature to show up when and where you want it to so you can set up the conditions needed to pull off the casting.

 

[ptolemy]

Charlaquin, you are entirely correct (as is MechaT with their comments about hold monster and Skid with their idea about Gate), it is possible, through great effort and danger, to use planar binding in a more creative manner. However, without being very high level or having to fund an entire expedition to acquire a servitor (or persuade the party to load spells and give time to satisfy your desires) the current summon spells are the most plausible way to go about summoning creatures and having them use their skills and abilities for you. My example of an invisible stalker had the ability to always know the location of the thing it was hunting. Azers were famous for smithing ability. Relatively low powered things could cast healing spells or bless or, well, you get the picture. The flip side was that opposing casters could charm your pets, dispel your control and leave you to deal with angry fiends or whatever. I had already lamented (but not entirely got over) the reduction in summoning spells from the old Monster Summoning I-IX which allowed for a summoner build which didn't cast any spells other than summons and just used their magics. Not only did they get rid of these spells but (and I don't know why this happened) they also stripped the vast majority of magic from a lot of creatures and made most of them walking slabs of HP. But at least the elementals gave some flexibility and fun. Now planar binding appear to mainly function as a way of having a summoned spirit without need to concentrate. And I realise that is something major. However, it is a fraction of what was possible and feels that it is pulling the magician into being focused on combat in a game which is famous for being combat centric. I suppose I am left wondering why a spell invented when magic users could summon a huge variety of creatures without there being a concentration rule (which makes the whole things a good deal harder) is still included. Once it was a scary power which meant you had arrived. Now it is mainly a way of avoiding a rule constraint. I wonder why they kept it in the game.

I’ll just add, by way of an edit, that there are lots of fun ways to achieve goals. The concentration thing can be circumnavigated with cunning use of glyph spells. The iron flask (personally my most desired item but one I have never managed to acquire) makes this all a lot easier (if you even need to bother), and questing to capture a creature which will make a huge difference can be really fun for a party.

And is also add that I love a lot of the things from 5e compared to the AD&D which I grew up playing. It was really important to prevent the total overshadowing of non-magic users at high levels and to let magicians survive past first level. I just don’t like all of what has been changed.

 

[MechaTarrasque]

I seem to remember a WotC twitter (X) thing a while ago that said binding was meant to be a team activity in 5e. "Friends don't let friends bind solo" or something like that. Binding is supposed to be more of a mini quest for the whole party, rather than what the wizard does in an afternoon back in town between adventures.