D&D 3E/3.5 persistent spell 3.5

[Shard O'Glase]

Ok in the new FR book it is at +6 spell levels I suspect its at +6 spell levels in CD as well thanks to some discussion of the divine metamagic feat in general discussion. Ok maybe it was too good at +4 spell levels for a few specific spells but at +6 levels its a waste of space for pretty much every spell in the game with maybe 1 or two exceptions. So +6 spell levels is the best these guys could come up with?

Would it of been such a challenge to actually rewrite the feat instead of just cut and pasting it and slapping on a higher cost in spell levels. How about a variable cost based on the initial duraiton of the spell, like +1 spell level for 1 hour duration, +2 for 10 min/level, +4 for 1/min level and +6 for 1 round a level duration. Or have it be a lower spell elvel boost but have it only boost it up a time category, for example changes 1 orund a level duraiton spells to 1 min a level, and then make it stackable with itself. Virtaully anything would of been better than what they did, heck leaving it out of the game would of been better.

 

[Thanee]

Yeah, the variable one would have been a good idea, really.

I actually thought about changing Extend Spell to the upping duration to the next step (rounds to minutes (maybe leave that out), minutes to 10 minutes, 10 minutes to hours, hours to days, ...) for +2 levels. Extend Spell really isn't all that useful without stacking with itself. Still nice on some occasions, but those tend to be rather elusive.

Anyways, I totally agree, that this change was very insensitive.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Darklone]

And all because one single spell ... Divine Favor. Couldn't they have changed that one to 1/4 levels as well???

 

[hong]

And all because one single spell ... Divine Favor. Couldn't they have changed that one to 1/4 levels as well???

Or have it max out at +3, instead of +6. I'm not aware of any other 1st level spell with a scaling effect that scales all the way to 18th level.

 

[beaver1024]

Or have it max out at +3, instead of +6. I'm not aware of any other 1st level spell with a scaling effect that scales all the way to 18th level.

What about Produce Flame and Shield of Faith. Notice they're all divine spells.

 

[beaver1024]

Contrary to popular opinion the feat never was the problem. If it was a problem, a heap more spells would arise as being overpowered because of the feat. At +4 levels, there were hardly any arcane spells worth Persisting except for divinations maybe. However even at +6 levels, it would still be worth it just for Divine Favour. Just goes to show how powerful cleric spells are.

 

[ruleslawyer]

Um, no. That's still a problem with the feat, not the spell(s). Duration is a fine balancing factor; after all, bull's strength would hardly be worth a 2nd-level slot if it lasted 1 round, right? The issue with PS is that it creates a fixed duration out of a variable duration, thereby having a vastly disproportionate effect on certain spells (DF, DM, RM; heck, even shield) which have short durations. Moreover, the restriction attached to the feat (Personal/Fixed-range spells only) is completely arbitrary, and limits only the scope of its application, not the potential power of its application. In theory, I could research Personal-only versions of several popular Touch or other range spells out there; according to the spell research guidelines, those spells should NOT be higher-level than their touch-range equivalents, and could even be lower level. However, I could then Persist those spells to terrifying effect. Hello, Persistent enlarge person, true seeing, greater invisibility, etc.

IMHO, the duration increment increase that Shard alludes to is the best way to apply the feat; +2 or +3 levels for a one-increment bump (rounds to minutes, minutes to 10 minutes, 10 minutes to hours, hours to days) with no restriction on types of spells seems fair to me.

 

[Thanee]

Contrary to popular opinion...

Sometimes, there is a reason, why one particular opinion is particularily popular.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Christian]

IMHO, the duration increment increase that Shard alludes to is the best way to apply the feat; +2 or +3 levels for a one-increment bump (rounds to minutes, minutes to 10 minutes, 10 minutes to hours, hours to days) with no restriction on types of spells seems fair to me.

I think you want some restriction on types of spells. Unless you like seeing Melf's Persistent Acid Arrow of Certain Doom.

 

[Scion]

It would've probably been best for them to just make a nice list like permanency.

List a bunch of spells that could be used, list the level adjustment, be done with it. Basically make some good guidelines, and state a few spells that shouldnt be used with it. That way the number of spells could be expanded, but keeping out the ones that would be overpowered (even though it cant be done, melfs acid arrow being persistant is just funny )