Occult Slayer & Spell Turning.

[Scratched_back]

Mind over Magic (Su): Starting at 2nd level, an occult slayer can cause a spell or spell-like ability targeted against her to rebound onto the originator as a free action. This ability otherwise functions as the spell turning spell (caster level equals the character's occult slayer level +5). An occult slayer can use this ability once per day at 2nd level and twice per day at 4th level.

This has recently caused a slight arguement between a friend and I, as there are two quite valid interpretations:

1) This ability functions just as spell turning does, except it has no duration and is in effect a 'one off' and the level of spell you are allowed to turn is your occult slayer level +5, mistakingly reffered to as caster level.

2) This ability functions just as spell turning, although any singular spell can be turned by it, irrespective of level. The caster level is provided to show workings, for want of a better phrase, and so other variable effects can b taken into account. Wording suggests it can turn a single spell, not certain spells of certain levels etc.

As always, we turn to ENWorld for clarification and opinions on our disputes.

Cheers all

 

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

I'm in the #2 camp.

Spell Turning normally allows a certain number of spell levels to be turned throughout the duration.

This effect has no duration, but can only work on a single spell per "invocation."

As to "functions as the spell turning spell," that likely refers to the following:

If you and a spellcasting attacker are both warded by spell turning effects in operation, a resonating field is created.
Roll randomly to determine the result.

As to the caster level issue, I can't think of any reason that the caster level of an (Su) ability would be important, but it's there just in case it is (like, for instance, a notional higher-level spell turning effect that calls for a caster level check whenever the above-mentioned situation occurs).

 

[Scratched_back]

As to the caster level issue, I can't think of any reason that the caster level of an (Su) ability would be important, but it's there just in case it is (like, for instance, a notional higher-level spell turning effect that calls for a caster level check whenever the above-mentioned situation occurs).

I thought as much. I shall explain this to him, possibly with a smug smile. I still like multiple opinions though, to be sure

 

[moritheil]

Patryn's answer is logical, although I have to say it seems ridiculously powerful. Reflect any spell, including epic spells and those cast by deities?

 

[Scratched_back]

Patryn's answer is logical, although I have to say it seems ridiculously powerful. Reflect any spell, including epic spells and those cast by deities?

That's just the thing... it IS veery powerful. Coupled with other abilities this PrC gets, he's unbelievable! Every fighter type fears getting dominated at the decent levels, like 12+, but if you take 5 levels as this mini-prestige, you're 100% immune, no ifs, no buts... and you can turn spells etc etc...

 

[moritheil]

That's just the thing... it IS veery powerful. Coupled with other abilities this PrC gets, he's unbelievable! Every fighter type fears getting dominated at the decent levels, like 12+, but if you take 5 levels as this mini-prestige, you're 100% immune, no ifs, no buts... and you can turn spells etc etc...

In light of which, I can only postulate more crack-addled writers lacking a refined sense of balance.

 

[Ferrix]

Patryn's answer is logical, although I have to say it seems ridiculously powerful. Reflect any spell, including epic spells and those cast by deities?

That's just the thing... it IS veery powerful. Coupled with other abilities this PrC gets, he's unbelievable! Every fighter type fears getting dominated at the decent levels, like 12+, but if you take 5 levels as this mini-prestige, you're 100% immune, no ifs, no buts... and you can turn spells etc etc...

100% immune to two spells a day! Woo doggie! Oh wait, also has to be a targetted spell, there goes all of those area of affect spells.

In light of which, I can only postulate more crack-addled writers lacking a refined sense of balance.

Well, if it were a constant effect, yes, yet note that it can be used at most twice a day. Not that powerful.

 

[moritheil]

100% immune to two spells a day! Woo doggie! Oh wait, also has to be a targetted spell, there goes all of those area of affect spells.

Well, if it were a constant effect, yes, yet note that it can be used at most twice a day. Not that powerful.

The immunity I don't care about - it's the automatic rebounding of epic spells that I have trouble seeing as balanced. It does turn them back against their caster, right?

 

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

Of course, it only works on specifically targeted spells. As in, you cannot turn a meteor swarm. You could turn a DC 400 Epic Charm spell, but then the caster's just Charmed himself, and what good does that really do?

 

[moritheil]

Of course, it only works on specifically targeted spells. As in, you cannot turn a meteor swarm. You could turn a DC 400 Epic Charm spell, but then the caster's just Charmed himself, and what good does that really do?

I'm thinking of that nifty "save vs. ridiculous DC or die" spell that someone had Asmodeus casting at the PCs in their campaign. I'd link it, but I forget who wrote it.