Neutral/Evil spontaneous Cure vs Inflict

[greycastle]

Heres my idea...

While i believe a Evil cleric should only be able to rebuke/control undead, i can only partially agree that he can only spontaneously cast Inflict Wounds *and while i love harm, still...i'd rather live, than die and have then on 1d4 hp*

But what about the Neutral Cleric? wouldn't it be plausible to possibly even serve an evil god, and so use Rebuke/Control undead, but since your neutral *meaning your in it not to spread good/evil, but just for yourself* that you should be able to choose to either use cure or inflict? *though once chosen at the start, this cannot be altered*

possibly this is better for the hoisue rule forum, but while i've wanted to play a Good Cleric, i've also wanted to REALLY play a cleric of Bane (FR god, Lawful Evil) but the idea of being able to go Lawful Neutral, and yet, have to waste spellslots just to heal myself, seems almost outrageous...

I feel that even if you learn to control and possess undead servants, if your not a specific inflicter of pain/suffering, and neither cause good nor evil, should you not be able to choose what rebuke/control/inflict vs turn/destroy/cute?

Couldn't you mix and match? e.g. Rebuke/Control/Cure?
Turn/Destroy/Inflict?

Any opinons? and be honest, if you just disagree completely with what i said, i don't have any qualms...i jsut need to know, if this could even be a fair houserule, as even say a cleric of Kelemvor *another FR god, of death, lawful neutral* should be able to command, yet cure, since your not naturally evil...

Well, any opinons, all are most welcome...

 

[Hypersmurf]

While i believe a Evil cleric should only be able to rebuke/control undead, i can only partially agree that he can only spontaneously cast Inflict Wounds *and while i love harm, still...i'd rather live, than die and have then on 1d4 hp*

You can't spontaneously cast Harm or Heal, only Cure/Inflict X Wounds.

But what about the Neutral Cleric? wouldn't it be plausible to possibly even serve an evil god, and so use Rebuke/Control undead, but since your neutral *meaning your in it not to spread good/evil, but just for yourself* that you should be able to choose to either use cure or inflict? *though once chosen at the start, this cannot be altered*

No - the choice you make is whether you channel positive energy, which heals and turns; or negative energy, which inflicts and rebukes.

You can't have it both ways.

-Hyp.

 

[greycastle]

hmm....well...

1. Can a Neutral cleric with Turn/Destroy undead and Cure X wounds spontaenously cast, create and have undead?

2. Do your turning checks vs other undead affect your undead since their yours?

3. is it possibly to channel positive energy yet have an undead army at your control?

4. is it worth trading in your cure spontaenously casting, for *possibly* power?

5. is it worth at all playing an neutral/evil cleric?

 

[Hypersmurf]

1. Can a Neutral cleric with Turn/Destroy undead and Cure X wounds spontaenously cast, create and have undead?

With Animate Dead, you can create skeletons and zombies that serve you. With Create Greater Undead, you can create other types... but they don't automatically serve you, and you can't control them with a Turning Check. So in general, casting Create Greater Undead is a bad idea.

A Good cleric can't cast Animate Dead, but a Neutral cleric can.

2. Do your turning checks vs other undead affect your undead since their yours?

Yup. Make sure they're out of range, because skeletons and zombies will tend to have lower hit dice than anyhting else you're trying to turn.

3. is it possibly to channel positive energy yet have an undead army at your control?

Well, if you consider 2HD of skeletons or zombies per level an "army"

4. is it worth trading in your cure spontaenously casting, for *possibly* power?

5. is it worth at all playing an neutral/evil cleric?

4 and 5 - it's up to what you have in mind.

-Hyp.

 

[greycastle]

I only have two things in mind actually

- a REALLY good roleplaying character to paly *seeing as my DM might not let me play my fey'ri since eveyrone else is going standard races*

- someone powerful...i was actually hoping to be able to create greater undead....but i'm just so depressed about the idea of burning spell slots to heal...

 

[Christian]

It's a balance issue, I think, as well. Casting spontaneous cure spells is a more useful/powerful ability than casting spontaneous inflict spells; rebuking/controlling undead is more powerful than turning/destroying undead. (Would you rather destroy the undead, or leave them active but working for you instead of against you?) If the neutral cleric didn't have to pick them in pairs, the min/maxer would obviously choose the cure spells and the rebuke/control ability.

 

[Murrdox]

Greycastle:

My last Cleric was a Lawful Neutral Cleric to Jergal (A former God of Death in FR). He was VERY neutral and despised the fact that the undead are used for evil purposes. His goal was to animate the dead to prevent evil forces from doing so, and use their own "tools" against them. And also to show that the undead could be used for purposes other than evil.

Yes, I kept a couple of spell slots devoted to healing spells, but since I was still "good" I had a large interest in keeping the party healed... so I spent most of my starting money on a wand of cure moderate wounds. Use your heal spells for last minute healing, use the wand for everything else.

While cure spells are obviously more useful, inflict spells have their uses as well - especially if you get spell focus in it, so it's harder for opponents to save.

 

[Kae'Yoss]

Not being able to cast cure spells spontaneously is the main downside of evil clerics. But those cure spells you prepare give you great power over the party:
"Heal me, cleric"
"Hm.... I don't know, with you not agreeing with my plan to go to the north... I don't think it's in my god's interests to heal you!"

And remember inflict spells are cure spells for your undead army (and for you, if you become undead)

 

[Voadam]

Doesn't Kelemvor hate undead and have all his clerics destroy them when he can?

 

[Murrdox]

The Evil Cleric in my group was recently quite cheesed off when I reminded him that he can't cast "Protection from Evil", since he's evil.

In all honesty... I forgot about it too!