I need a reason for a mass battle between giants and dragons

[Sword of Spirit]

I'm looking for suggestions of how to get the giants and dragons in my game to go to war. I'm running a game in a version of the 5e Monster Manual backstory lore when giants and dragons battled in endless wars in ancient days. That's the backdrop, ongoing conflict, sometimes a cold war, sometimes flare-ups, etc.

I need to justify a massive battle with each of the 6 giant species marching to a location to fight a large number of dragons.

The only problem is figuring out why they would all get together in a stand up fight like that. The smart dragon doesn't get pinned down. The smart giant knows that and doesn't expect to find dragons standing around waiting to trade blows.

I have one lead--a king of the storm giants that was well respected by all the giants died recently. That can be tied into it.

So, what would be worth getting the armies of the giants and the hordes of the dragons to all meet on the field of battle at a specific place and time?

 

[Dioltach]

Accusations have been made that the king's death was brought about by a group of dragons, for political reasons. The matter is to be decided in trial by combat. Considering the potentially sweeping implications, both sides will be represented by armies rather than single champions.

 

[RobbieAB]

The giants have just learned of the existence of a Dragon Orb (or equivalent item) which the dragons are guarding?

The dragons can't interact with the Orb, so they can't simply withdraw with it, and they have only just found it and are trying to organise a "safe" method to move it or destroy it.

 

[Celebrim]

It entirely depends on what Dragons and Giants are in your campaign.

In my campaign Dragons are the physical personification of natural violence - earthquakes, volcanos, hurricanes, floods, etc. They are intelligent beings but their motivations wouldn't necessarily strike a human as rational because they don't have what humans would perceive to be a rational purpose. Mostly they horde wealth, sleep, and then occasionally unleash random periods of intense violence and destruction.

Giants on the other hand are the direct descendants of the Gods dalliances with powerful elemental lords, such as the rulers of the genies. They are basically demigods and have all the hubris of the same, though less races such as Hill Giants or Ogres are diluted (or polluted, depending on your perspective) with mortal blood and regarded as mongrels and slaves by the greater races. They form their own kingdoms, have their own quarrels, their own politics, their own interests, and are largely similar to mortals save on a grander scale. If giants go to war, it's for reasons similar to why mortals would go to war - gain wealth or land, avenge insults, defend themselves from perceived encroachment by powerful neighbors, subjugate lesser nations, and so forth.

So my answer would be something like, "Either the dragons have angered a giant nation by depridations, or else the dragons have something the giants want."

But in my case, because the stone giants and the cloud giants are children of dao and djinn respectively, the two quite literally hate each other more than anything else in the world. They consider each other completely and utterly offensive and indeed blasphemous. I can't imagine anything that would get the two to work together, nor would ever the Fire Giants march to war alongside the Storm Giants for any reason I can imagine. They'd go to war against each other in a heart beat if they could, but I can't imagine anything that would make them work together. If one was attacked by dragons, the other would respond, "Good." In sense, their realms are so far apart that its hard even to imagine what they would see as a mutual threat, and in general it wouldn't be dragons since the dragons themselves are typically divided up as allies of the different giant groups - white dragons with frost giants, red dragons with fire giants, blue dragons with cloud giants, sea dragons with storm giants, and so forth.

Work out who the actors are and what they want and the reasons will suggest themselves. Or even work back from your desired end state toward the question of what dragons and giants are with the purpose in mind of having them engage in a great battle with each other. Maybe giants in your world represent the forces of order and dragons the forces of chaos. Then its natural for these forces to occasionally clash.

 

[GMMichael]

So, what would be worth getting the armies of the giants and the hordes of the dragons to all meet on the field of battle at a specific place and time?

The same things that get real armies to meet on the field of battle? Resources and political/military power?

The dragons have held strategic mountaintops in the past, but cloud giant castles have been slowly positioning closer and closer to these mountaintops. Conveniently, diplomacy failed.

The giants are running low on nickel ore, and the dragon's homes just happen to be rich with it. It just happens that the ore is great for making giant-axes shiny and good for conducting lightning bolts.

Of course, the giant and dragon leaders will say that the other side is threatening their freedoms or religious destiny.

 

[Water Bob]

Giants stole the dragon eggs and ate their babies. Dragons are pissed. And, the Giants aren't going to take any lip from the dragons.

War.

 

[cmad1977]

Dragons fighting giants?? That sounds like reason enough to me.

 

[amerigoV]

Giants stole the dragon eggs and ate their babies. Dragons are pissed. And, the Giants aren't going to take any lip from the dragons.

War.

I was thinking something similar - a Red Dragon Omelette should do the trick.

 

[Sword of Spirit]

Thanks everyone.

I'm sticking pretty closely to the giant (and dragon) lore in the monster manual, so giants and dragons have been enemies for a long time, and the giant's ordning means they can and will work together as needed to fight their ancient foes.

The greatest difficulty isn't getting them to fight, but making sure both side commit an army to the field and are so dedicated that they are unlikely to flee when things look bad. In other words, I want these armies destroying each other. If it ends up that the "victorious side" loses 80% of their forces, and the losers are reduced to a handful that scatter at the end, that would be ideal. That's what needs the really powerful motivations. Dragons are more into guerilla warfare, I would expect, and aren't likely to stay and die just over land.

What I'm currently thinking is that there is some sort of territorial aspect, but it is vitally important to both sides that the other side not be able to hold the land. I don't want there to be an alternative win condition to destroying the other army, so I can't just have a "capture the McGuffin" thing going on. I might potentially have a "destroy the McGuffin" as long as it really hard to destroy and ends up with the same effect of the two armies having a massive clash.

I'm thinking perhaps some sort of obelisk or other immobile monument in some area that has powers somewhat similar to an orb of dragonkind, though it might affect more than just dragons. Whoever maintains control over it has a decisive advantage in any conflicts. I'm not sure what exactly it should do, and I need to have some sort of idea before I start the adventure.

I'm thinking that perhaps there was a sort of truce that had been going on for a while. The giants had territory, the dragons had territory. Neither side had violated the other's territory, but small-scale fighting in the neutral zone was perfectly fine and didn't break the truce. If the king ended up in some situation where the dragons killed him in a way that the giants would find deeply offensive and in violation of the truce, then they would feel a desire for revenge. But in order to commit massive forces to an invasion there needs to be a reason to take and maintain the land. If the dragons were seeking to control the immobile artifact that is a good way to cause them to root in place and have the fight.

In that situation I'd need to know what the artifact does, where it is, who discovered it first, how the king died, why it was a truce violation, etc. I'm not sure of what those answers should be, and any additional advice is appreciated.

The king was a good guy, and would be unlikely to break the truce without good reason. But I want the situation to be such that neither side is blameless (there are good and evil creatures on both sides). The players are going to be playing the lords of the giants, and I'm going for an impression of a savage setting where that ain't no good guys, there ain't no bad guys, they are just fighting for their side because it's us vs. them.

I have a scene in mind at the beginning where there is an ancient silver dragon who has been friends with the sister of the slain storm giant king. I imagine him coming for a visit, along the lines of, "So you are committed to this course then? Well, I suppose it must be. Farewell my friend," and he flies off (she probably let's him go).

 

[Gilladian]

Well, to bring the dragons down and make them fight the giants face to face, without fleeing, there has to be something overwhelmingly important that they are guarding. Maybe an injured or otherwise unable-to-leave the scene dragon. The ancient dragon high priest has to conduct a tremendously important ritual at a particular place and time. The dragons had tried to conduct it secretly, but the giant king somehow got a hint of what was going on, and showed up unexpectedly. In the ensuing confrontation, something broke the truce, and the giant king was slain. On holy ground. The dragons are now forced to defend their turf so they can complete the ritual, which only has X more days/weeks to go! The giants, of course, are intent on disrupting the ritual, recovering their fallen king's body so they can have a proper funeral, and revenging themselves.