How tough is City of the Spider Queen?

Iron_Chef

First Post
My DM is trying to run our conquest-happy little group of devout Banites through The City of the Spider Queen. So far, we are getting consistently clobbered, only making it through a couple of rooms/caverns before getting nearly annihilated and having to retreat. We just started this adventure two sessions ago, and haven't beaten the first level yet, LOL.

How tough is this adventure supposed to be? I don't want spoilers, but it's freaking killing us so far and I'd like to know if it just keeps getting tougher. I really hate fighting undead, drow and demons...

Our group:

PC #1: LE human female Wizard (Conjurer with Evocation and Necromancy opposed schools) 5/Master Summoner 2/Mindbender 1/Nar Demon Binder 1/Mystic 1/Theurgist 1 (she collects PrCs but quickly loses interest in advancing in them if they limit her spell progression). Useless in combat aside from spells. Has an Imp familiar, also useless in combat. Both have darkvision. She has Spell Penetration, Spell Focus Enchantment and Greater Spell Focus Conjuration (high DCs combined with her 22 INT/Spellcasting Prodigy feat and +1 to all spell DC bracelet).

Her problem is, most everything we are running into has spell resistance, AND massive elemental resistance (20) or immunities (and almost all her damaging spells do acid damage). Most of her spells are completely ineffective against outsiders, undead and constructs. She has a lot of mind affecting magic, buffing and utility spells, but her combat spells are limited because of her oposition school choices. She is completely helpless in a fight if her spells don't work on the enemy, she doesn't even have a magic dagger and her BAB is around +3 at level 11... She just found a wand of greater magic weapon, so that should help the group out.

PC #1's Cohort: LE human female Ftr 2/Wizard (Transmuter) 4. Wand of Lightning Bolt (5th level). MW Bastard Sword. A ruthless, cold-hearted, supremely efficient lesbian human (Zhent) supremacist, LOL. Can cast Fear 1/day (DC 15).

PC #2: LE human male Cleric 9 of Bane/Ftr 1. Largely useless in combat aside from casting spells. This oily villain weighs over 300 pounds and really lazy except when he's trying to charm/dominate or hold everything (preferably female and attractive) in sight. If none of the above options work, his idea is to run (waddle) away, leaving his companions to their doom (which hopefully gives him enough time to wander off in search of whores and ale). He's got a MW bladed gauntlet. Can cast Fear 1/day (DC 18)

PC #3: LE mh/half (red) dragon Rog 7/Ftr 2 (ECL 12), dual wielding a +1 flaming rapier and +1 rapier. He can fly 1 hour/day and has darkvision, plus a ring of invisibility. He can do a ridiculous amount of damage under the right circumstances but we keep running into incorporeal creatures like ghosts (which he always blows his miss chance on) or creatures you need a +2 weapon to hit (like Bebiliths), so he can still get his ass kicked. He's obnoxious and arrogant, but supremely clever (INT 20) when he has to be.

We hardly have any offensive magic items, and only a modest amount of defensive and utility magic items. None of us particularly want to do this adventure, but Bane (Read: The DM) is rail-roading us. Apparently, some necromancer has stolen a rod of power from Zhentil Keep and is sending it to the drow city of Maerimydra to open some sort of portal to the Negative Material Plane or some such folly. All we know from comune spells so far is that "the rod will be used against the interests of Bane" and it is "time sensitive" for us to recover the Rod. We don't know what the rod is or does exactly, though we did see it once (we ended up giving it over to a vampire servant of the necromancer in Zhentil Keep, who just hapened to be poor PC #1's father whom she let be tortured/murdered by the necromancer rather than give in to blackmail to prevent her from her duties in rebuilding the walls of Zhentil Keep). The DM is changing some things up a bit to get us involved, since altruism isn't in our nature... nor is greed, when it comes to a suicidal mission like this.

Advice?
 

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Iron_Chef said:
[ I really hate fighting undead, drow and demons...

[/B]

I hate to break it to you but if your DM is going to insist on this Module, get used to it.

Personally this is not one of my favorites, always seemed a little bland to me, but I have huge problems with WOTC stat blocks being in an apendex in the back of the module, wrecks the flow for me.

I would say acquire more people, 3PCs and a low level cohort are not going to cut the proverbial mustard for this. Spearholders, hirelings, more cohorts, anything to raise the numbers in your party, Especially some straight melee classes.

I would also work on tactics, if you have a conjur specialist have her summon some nasty critters, no spell resistance problems, and a good critter properly placed can usually cause some disruption. Indirect spells can work wonders in an Underdark environment, rock to mud, distengrate, the various wall spells, very easy to alter the battlefield to your advantage.

I would have the cleric max out their rebuke abillity, increased turning attempts, maybe a charisma boost, you should be able to garner some short term allies that way, though unlike most groups the portable holy land is not going to be an option. I would also reccomend using the cleric to boost save,(resistance etc), since undead, demons, and drow(oh my) tend to encourage saves.

Above all plan, you already know that you are going to be going on a huge underground magical mystery tour, so consider aspects like supply lines, camp guards, armorsmiths, a resident sage for consoltations, rangers to help track, wagons, donkeys, guard dogs, shirppas, and potables like food, potions, scrolls, torches etc. I'm not saying the portable army is the best approach for this module, but from both a player and a DMs perspective I have always enjoyed the planning and marshaling of resources component, it might give you increased enjoyment, a greater sense of realism (cave spelunching requires quite a bit of planning in reallife), and frankly control over your environment.
 

Its a pretty poor excuse for a module in my opinion, just a meatgrinder really.

Pick a spot on the FR map at random and go visit that instead :D
 

The problem is, most of the critters she can summon don't have magic weapons and can't damage the DR 10/+1 monsters in the least.

The DM is overjoyed because using City of the Spider Queen means he "doesn't have to think" anymore. :mad: So instead of the kind of adventures we want (political, roleplaying, short-term mass combat), we're stuck in hack-n-slash mode with PCs/players who are ill-equipped psychologically AND game mechanically to pull off this adventure.

The DM was complaining about the rapid rate of PC levelling and tried to jack up the XP requirements to level up, so the player response was to forego any and all aid from "XP stealers" (NPC allies). This pissed the DM off, but forced him to return XP requirements back to normal... however, it didn't change the player policy of trying to "go it alone" without aid of any kind... the DM's response was "okay, but you're the ones killing your characters, not me." To be fair, the DM is generally a great DM, but he has almost zero prep time with a wife, two kids and a job that forces him to work overtime using his voice and brain, plus a two hour commute each day to the office. On the other hand, the players resent being rail roaded---especially when this is the first time they've bothered to play uber-religious types. So, the lesson of that character choice is, apparently, never to be religious ever again. The problem is, we committed ritual suicide in Bane's name and He true resurrected us as his agents. If we turn our backs on Bane, he can kill us with a snap of his fingers, and our souls are bound to him in death, preventing any return to life without his consent.

We really do feel ripped-off by this sudden turn of events, as we were just laying the groundwork to take over Mistledale when this dumb crap we could care less about happens, throwing all our plans into the crapper.Now, I wouldn't have objected to a short-term attack on the necromancer's tower or to destroy the vampires in the Keep, but an extended hack-n-slash through the UnderDark is totally unwanted and unenjoyable. The sad thing is, the same DM did the exact same thing to us in our last Zhentil Keep campaign, sending us through the godawful year long trek through the UnderDark in THE NIGHT BELOW box set. 40 grell all at once attacking us was the height of insanity... add in endless hordes (actualy entire cities) of kuo-toa, aboleth... and you've got pretty much the worst, most unfun adventure ever.

I think this campaign is going down the crapper quick unless the DM dramatically shortens the module to just the "crunchy bits".
 
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well.. my party is doing CotSQ as well.. and well.. we are romping through it.. combine Rings of the Darkhidden.. and the blindsight spell.. and no light.. Drow have a real hard time dealing with that. You kill them.. and they don't know you are coming...
 

The DM knows we hate meatgrinders, too, so he should really know better than to run crap like this on us. He is going to promote major player rebellion for forcing us to go through this dumb mega-module. Yet he does this to us at least once every campaign, like RttToEE and Heart of Nightfang Spire last year (ugh, though Nightfang Spire was much better---i.e., shorter). We totally rebelled against RttToEE and so he had to trash it. I think we will do the same with CotSQ. It totally blows so far.

Why can't WoTC put out intelligent, creative roleplaying oriented political intrigue adventures? Why must mega-modules always suck and be nothing but brain-dead, endless meatgrinders with little to no opportunities for RPing aside from talking to members of your own party?
 
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We just started it ... two evenings of gaming behind us. Just cleared some of the crypts, we don't open everything ... fought the bebiliths and the first group of drow.

The bebiliths got surprise on us the first time, the cleric lost his armor and we fled. We came back the second time, and is was easy, the bearlord killed a bebilith singlehanded.

The first group of drow went down real fast, in large part due to the Improved Grab of the bears, that got the cleric and the arcane caster.

We later encountered some creatures from earlier crypts and they went down pretty fast, considering only two of our characters where there.

So far we haven't encountered something really powerfull, though some of the undead casters were nasty.

For the RP, it helped a lot that our illusionist dominated one of the first drow, so know we know much better what we're up against ... we're gonna use that tactic more often.


The group is:
Human Male Drd 5 / Bearlord 5
- Does good damage in Brown Bear shape
- Animal companion is Awakened Brown Bear with 10 HD, that does the real damage ... gets two "magic fangs" for 9 hours of +3 every day

Human Sor 1 / Clr 7 / Dragon Disciple 2
- decent fighter
- semidecent caster

Half-Orc Brb 1 / Clr 9
- good fighter
- good caster

Half-Elf Rog 7 / Dungeon Delver 3
- bad fighter
- semi-decent scout

Human Sor 6 / Elemental Savant 4
- Good ranged damage machine

Stand-inn character:
Gnome Illusionist 10
- some nice tricks
 
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Iron_Chef said:
The problem is, most of the critters she can summon don't have magic weapons and can't damage the DR 10/+1 monsters in the least.

I don't have the books in front of me so I can't check (I am at work) but I find it hard to beleive that Summon Monster VI can't get you a fiendish creature with DR.

Celestial creatures would be even better, 'cause of the smite, but I am not sure if an evil character can summon them.

glass.
 

Iron_Chef said:

Why can't WoTC put out intelligent, creative roleplaying oriented political intrigue adventures? Why must mega-modules always suck and be nothing but brain-dead, endless meatgrinders with little to no opportunities for RPing aside from talking to members of your own party?

It's a shame, really. The absolutely stunning art in CotSQ is wasted in "this how it looks, then you waste it" kind of play. If they did an intelligent adventure with the production values of CotSQ I'd buy it in a heartbeat!

WotC adventure department should acquire the old WHFRP modules from the Enemy Within Campaign: Mistaken Identity, Shadows Over Bögenhafen and Death on the Reik. Read, comprehend, imitate. Ad full-colour art a la CotSQ and we'd have a winner.
 

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