How much money does the avarage commoner need?

[njorgard]

I know this might be covered in the core rules somewhere, but I was wondering how much money does the average commoner in a D&D fantasy type world handle in a year. I know that during the Middle Ages commoners and their families had to be pretty much self sufficient and live off the land. But then I started thinking about all those people who are neither farmers nor herders…the shopkeepers, the innkeepers, the clergy, cobblers, tanners, etc. How much do these people need in gp terms to live? How does this compare to the wealth adventurers carry around? Are adventurers like the “rock stars” of the world? Any comments or suggestions on this would be helpful.

 

[Wolfen Priest]

Well, I don't have my books with me, but I think the official amount a typical peasant (commoner) earns is one silver piece per day.

I've heard some valid arguments why this amount should be more like 1 gold piece per day, however; for example, how could a peasant possibly afford to buy a simple shortsword for home-defense (a real necessity in a typical D&D world) and support his family at the same time on 1 sp a day?

 

[NLP]

I've heard some valid arguments why this amount should be more like 1 gold piece per day, however; for example, how could a peasant possibly afford to buy a simple shortsword for home-defense (a real necessity in a typical D&D world) and support his family at the same time on 1 sp a day?

Most peasants would have a spear or bow in the house. They would also use things like pitchforks and other farming implements. A sword should be fairly rare and would only be found in the home of someone who served in the military in his youth or was part of the militia and thus supplied the weapon by the lord of the area.

I also think a great deal of a peasant's purchases would be handled through barter. I have 5 extra eggs you have an extra pale of milk. Let's trade. The same would be said about the general store. A farmer would bring in eggs, milk, etc to trade at the store for items they would need such as cloth or exotic items.

also keep in mind that peasants do not make money over the course of the year. All their money would come in after harvest time and the crops have been sold. It is then that a peasant would pay off accumulated bills at the general store and other people he owes money to. It is then that the peasant would payoff their required tax to the lord, either in money from the sale of crops, but more likely in grain or live animals. Any money left over from that would be put under the peasant’s bed to be saved for a rainy day or a bad crop season.

A peasant could live a normal life like this. There would not be too many extravagances, but under a good lord there would not be too many days of hunger either. Most peasants would seldom ever see a gold piece, but would have quite a few coppers and silvers tucked away in their shacks.

 

[Valmur_Dwur]

It's a SP a day for a peasant-type.

@Wolfen-priest Why does a peasant need a short-sword? If its anything at all medieval like then don't we have a landowner of some type to protect us? Besides a peasant wouldn't know how to use a martial weapon like a shortsword. He could wield a club or something that he would use on a daily basis like an axe(although the PHB doesn't allow this for a commoner). As to having a swortsword outside of that arguement try this. The Blacksmith or Armor-maker in your campaign could make a shortsword for oh let's say a basket of apples and 2 chickens and perhaps a bottle of homemade hooch! Use barter as a way that peasants are able to survive without money in hand. This really applies to the craft makers as well. When they get money from the pcs it really should make their day UNLESS they haven't had some delicacy in a while then they may do it for that instead! Need more coffee I'm rambling

 

[Sammael99]

Most peasants would have a spear or bow in the house. They would also use things like pitchforks and other farming implements. A sword should be fairly rare and would only be found in the home of someone who served in the military in his youth or was part of the militia and thus supplied the weapon by the lord of the area.

The issue I have with the whole "economic system" vaguely fleshed out in the DMG is that it's extremely low fantasy in a generally high fantasy setting. Things don't add-up.

There was a thread a while back and someone said he was aiming at redefining the D&D economy. I'd really love to see that happen...

 

[Wolfen Priest]

Most peasants would have a spear or bow in the house. They would also use things like pitchforks and other farming implements. A sword should be fairly rare and would only be found in the home of someone who served in the military in his youth or was part of the militia and thus supplied the weapon by the lord of the area.

I also think a great deal of a peasant's purchases would be handled through barter. I have 5 extra eggs you have an extra pale of milk. Let's trade. The same would be said about the general store. A farmer would bring in eggs, milk, etc to trade at the store for items they would need such as cloth or exotic items.

also keep in mind that peasants do not make money over the course of the year. All their money would come in after harvest time and the crops have been sold. It is then that a peasant would pay off accumulated bills at the general store and other people he owes money to. It is then that the peasant would payoff their required tax to the lord, either in money from the sale of crops, but more likely in grain or live animals. Any money left over from that would be put under the peasant’s bed to be saved for a rainy day or a bad crop season.

A peasant could live a normal life like this. There would not be too many extravagances, but under a good lord there would not be too many days of hunger either. Most peasants would seldom ever see a gold piece, but would have quite a few coppers and silvers tucked away in their shacks.

These are all very good points, but I think they are reflective of a medieval economy rather than a 'typical' D&D economy. Granted, using the standard ruleset a commoner cannot even use a shortsword, so that was a bad example.

But what if the campaign is not based on a feudal economy at all? Then, rather than talking about serf-like peasants laboring under a lord, we might be talking about a cobbler or tanner, working in a city as a member of a craft-guild. In such a case, according to the rules at least, the person would indeed earn about a silver piece a day (not seasonal). The question is, is this really enough money to support a family in a 'typical' D&D world? I don't know how much a shortspear is (or some other common simple weapon) but bows are not cheap, IIRC.

An sp a day would barely be enough to feed and clothe a family of 5, let alone buy a home in a small town and pay for something as relatively simple as a bow.

So the question is, if there are hundreds of thousands of gold-pieces floating around in a given economy, would 1 sp/day really be the going rate for a typical 'normal person?'

 

[njorgard]

Yes, I think Wolfen Priest has a very valid point. a D&D type fantasy world would definately have different economic dynamics than a true medeival world. The inclusion of guilds, spellcasters, miracle makers, and tons of big fat dungeons full of riches to plunder puts a different twist.

 

[NLP]

But what if the campaign is not based on a feudal economy at all? Then, rather than talking about serf-like peasants laboring under a lord, we might be talking about a cobbler or tanner, working in a city as a member of a craft-guild. In such a case, according to the rules at least, the person would indeed earn about a silver piece a day (not seasonal). The question is, is this really enough money to support a family in a 'typical' D&D world? I don't know how much a shortspear is (or some other common simple weapon) but bows are not cheap, IIRC.

Well, the examples I was using were from 17th through early 20th century America. I just used the word "Lord" instead of Government.

As far as bows, peasants who have them either made them or traded something they do have to someone who makes them. Once again this is a barter thing. "My wife makes great quilts, you make great long bows. How about 5 quilts, two pigs, and one week's free field work for a bow?"

The best way for you to come to grips with the money is to assign a real world value to the gold. If a mug of beer is 2 CP, and you know a beer costs $2.00 for a big mug where you live, then 1 CP = $1.00. Then just compute it up from there based on whatever dollar amount you currently have money being worth. So if you use 1 GP = 10 SP = 100 CP then 1 GP equals $100.00.

In modern US society it is fairly difficult to live on less than $1000.00 per month, which is 10 GP. But that is the average US economy. In Mexico you can live VERY WELL on $1,000.00 per month. In the Dominican Replublic a person could live half the year on $1,000.00. There is no way to give a fixed answer to your question as it entirely depends on the society which you are trying to emulate.

 

[Drawmack]

IMC the average commoner deals on the barter system. In the larger towns and cities an adventurer can spend their currency and turn their gems into currency but in a small town or village the merchants don't even want to hear about money. They have no where to spend money so it has no value to them as everything works on the barter system and the PHB has tables where things can easily be assigned equivolent values. It's really fun when the PCs come into town and need to trade something the own for lodging and food. I'll tell you though it leads to a well armed society. The fighter trades a short sword and two weeks of training to the local inn keep for three months lodging. The wizard trades some scrolls to the smith for armor repairs, so on and so forth.

As far as what you're saying about 1sp per day. I use a slightly inflated pay rate where money is used. I use 1gp/week. This is more then enough for the average peasant. Take into account that this is an average so your fighter buys a suit of mitheral armor and not the smith buys a house for his family.

 

[Wolfen Priest]

The best way for you to come to grips with the money is to assign a real world value to the gold. If a mug of beer is 2 CP, and you know a beer costs $2.00 for a big mug where you live, then 1 CP = $1.00. Then just compute it up from there based on whatever dollar amount you currently have money being worth. So if you use 1 GP = 10 SP = 100 CP then 1 GP equals $100.00.

So that would make a battle-axe cost $1500 by today's standards. A sword would be $2000. So let's make it more realistic and say that a firearm, (being a more modern and useful weapon), should then cost $2000. Which they don't.

So, I really don't see any point in trying to assign modern values to a fantasy world's items. Furthermore, I don't think that, even in the 'real' middle-ages, a farmer would have had to trade 5 quilts, 2 pigs, and a week's worth of field-labor for something as simple as a bow.

Plus, assuming most D&D settings have a fully functional economy, where trading is at a minimum and cash tender is commonly accepted form or payment, then either (a) the prices of common things need to go down (which could destroy some of the game-balance), or (b) commoners should earn more than 1 sp per day.

I keep thinking about the typical city-dwelling commoner. He might be a craftsman of some sort. In any case, these types make up the vast majority of people in most campaign worlds. The 'average laborer' earns 2 gold pieces a month, or around that (assuming he works 5 days a week); yet, a typical 'house' is listed at (I believe) 500 gp. So I really don't get how that works.