How does one destroy the Weave?

[Storminator]

Piece by piece, not all at once

In an FR game, my players are soon to shift to Shar. The Mistress of the Night would surely love to see the wizard in the group, soon to be a Red Wizard/Shadow Adept, learn a new spell that punches holes in the hated Weave.

A spell that creates a dead magic area is probably pretty powerful, if I assume an area effect of about 10' radius/level, what level should the spell be? And what are some new, lower level, spells that could be researched along the way?

Thanks,
PS

 

[rounser]

Wild magic messes it up as well, apparently, so a wild magic area could be just as good.

 

[Nightfall]

Toss out a LOT of chaos mages.

 

[Henry]

Ah, but here's the theme that you should put into your campaign that will screw with the players until they figure it out:

Damaging the weave does not do much to the Shadow Weave; but DESTROYING THE WEAVE ENTIRELY will also eliminate the shadow weave as well (the whole "no shadows without light" concept.) Have them eventually discover a process that would, once set in motion, gradually unravel the weave. Have them discover that their spells are slowly losing power along with the weave's power, and they must work to restore the balance.

Anyway, to hit your direct problem, Such a powerful spell I would make no LESS than 7th level, since the weave is a very difficult thing to break; it's resilient, and it contains the essence of the goddess Mystra herself. But don't forget that extensive use of this spell will trigger powerful foes for your PC's, not just the goody-goodies, but beings like The Harpells, Szass Tamm, and even Larloch, if the damage is nearby him. Ever wonder what a ticked-off 5000-year-old Lich with DemiLich servitors will do if you interrupt his ability to work magic?

 

[Knightcrawler]

Interesting idea. But I have to go with Henry on this one.

Your groups going to have everyone and I do mean everyone after them. Good, Evil, Neutral. Gods and Mortals. Also if Mystra doesn't start to notice them after they start using this spell your not doing your job as DM.

What are they going to do when all the Red Wizards, the Simbul, Eliminster, Szass Tam, Alustrieul, Manshoon I+, The Harpells, the Harpers, Larloch and every other magic using character in the FR that is not a Shadowweave user come looking to stop them?

And I seriously doubt AO will allow the Weave to be destroyed.

 

[I'm A Banana]

Phooey.

IMC, you destroy the Weave by calling on powers greater than Toril's little crystal sphere. Tentacled things of ancient power beyond even the concept of Ao.

Once something tentacled and hideous gets his claws into Toril's precious weave, you can bet it goes down in a BIG hurry. Shar. Mystra. Liches, Chosen, and Eliminster are all thrown into gibbering madness and/or impotence as a magic suddenly has a much higher price.

Though I'm one for big changes to my FR.

 

[Oni]

Putting balance aside for a moment, lets consider how such a spell would stand in comparison to the standard already set for the setting (this may or may not make a difference to you depending on how by the book your Realms is).

Magic of Faerun briefly touches on what it would take to permanently destroy as small section of the weave. This is what it has to say:

"Theoretically, wish and miracle spells could be used to create a dead magic area, but none have come forward with evidence that is is so."

Of course it also takes those spells to repair a small area of the weave.

So in the realms the ability of mortal magic to affect the weave in such a manner is very limited and can only be done with the most powerful of all mortal magic.

So you already have the spell to do it, but as you can see it is quite costly. In keeping with the established information I wouldn't allow any lower level spell to perform that function, and even at 9th it would certainly have a huge cost on par with Wish.

 

[William Ronald]

Good post, Oni.

I think it is important to stick with precedent in a setting. Damaging the weave would be quite difficult, so I think your guidelines on destroying the weave will work. However, by doing so, I suspect the characters will be attracting attention to themselves.

Thus, the players will have to struggle with a few of Shar's enemies. Of course, I think they would be better off hoping that they face the Chosen of Mystra than the Red Wizards of Thay. (Trying to alter magic problem annoys the Red Wizards greatly. Also, I don't think any character would like to be at the mercy of the Red Wizards. Not that the Red Wizards are known for mercy. )

 

[Alzrius]

I disagree with Henry's idea that destroying the Weave would result in also negating the Shadow Weave. The Shadow Weave exists in the spaces between the Weave, but it doesn't depend on it for it's own existence.

On the issue of making a permanent Dead Magic zone (for the Weave), let's look at the only comparable spell Antimagic Field. It is a 6th level spell for an arcane caster, and has a duration of 10/minutes/level, with a 10' radius emanation. It's pretty much unstoppable, since it cannot be dispelled and another Antimagic Field does not negate it.

A permanent Dead Magic zone would probably be a permanent application of the same magic (in mechanical terms), and wouldn't move with the caster. Given that it'd be a permanent affect that is already so powerful, I'd suggest it be at least 8th level for arcane casters, and 9th level if you want to expand the radius (about 20' or 30' should probably be the limit).

Note also that Shar would probably not love to see a Shadow Magic user going around blatantly destroying portions of the Weave in her name. That'd draw much too much attention to her. She has been working on the Shadow Weave for centuries upon centuries now, and is only now beginning to quietly spread the word of its existence. Her plan for the destruction of the Weave is, like her, quiet and subtle, not loud and violent like punching holes in it would be. As described in one of the FR books (I can't recall which one). Her hope is that more spellcasters will turn to the Shadow Weave, and then worship her to soothe the mental pain the learning it brings. Mystra, then, will lose power, losing divine ranks, and eventually fade out from non-worship (or perhaps Shar would kill her later). With the added worship then, Shar would be able to finally kill Selune. That is her ultimate plan.

 

[William Ronald]

A very good point on Shar's motivations, Alzrius. I am uncertain if it is possible to destroy the Weave and not impact the Shadow Weave, which is based on it. (If the Weave is necessary for life on Toril, Shar would not want it destroyed. A dead world does her no good.)

Shar is known for ptience and subtlety. Indeed, the actions of the characters may draw too much attention to her plans.

In which case, the characters might be hunted down by other followers of Shar!