Help with Fighter/Ranger

RBolyar2

First Post
Recently I joined a group to start playing D&D 3.5 and had a general concept for a Fighter/Ranger multiclass. They've since decided to play 4e, and I'm completely lost as to how a fighter/ranger hybrid works. I'm looking at all three player handbooks, and have tried googling general ideas. Also, I've read the thread posted about the fighter/ranger npc, but that's a whole matter altogether. Anyway, a quick backstory on my character:

He's the eldest son of an oppressive king of a distant land. Growing up he saw his father tax the poor and deal swiftly and cruely to those who would oppose him. My character frankly didn't care either way, beyond realizing that one day the years of abuse would culminate in the kingdom eventually rising up and overthrowing their family. His mother (the Queen) has been deceased since giving birth to his younger brother, who happens to be as cruel as his father. The younger brother has found himself in the father's favor because of the cruel way he also deals with the villagers. Yadda yadda yadda, my character decided to leave rather than deal with the inevitable uprising that will likely kill off the rest of his family. He feels no particular way about that, other than they've made their own bed and can now sleep in it. He spent his formidable years training with the knights
of the kingdom (thus the fighter background) and has also trained with local rangers who'm the king often hired as scouts for the numerous raiding he performed to the weakened villages of the north.

So, my goal is to create a vanilla character. A regular jack of all trades type can fights with two weapons (short swords probably), and a bow, but doesn't necessarily excel at any of them really.


Any suggestions?
 

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A 3.x fighter/ranger is pretty straigh forward. My advice would be to decide what you wanted out of the character in 3.5 and go with the class that suits you the most. If you want to be tankish and do decent damage build a tempest fighter, spend a feat or two on skill training (including multiclass). If you want to just do damage go ranger. What were you hoping to get from fighter in 3e mechanically aside from the feats?

Tempest wants Chain or lighter anyway. Go hide + dex.

In either case, focus on strength and dexterity with a bit of wisdom to use both swords and bow. If you want some more out of the other class multiclass and take a power or two for taste.

Either of these should accomplish what you could in 3e.
 

A 3.x fighter/ranger is pretty straigh forward. My advice would be to decide what you wanted out of the character in 3.5 and go with the class that suits you the most. If you want to be tankish and do decent damage build a tempest fighter, spend a feat or two on skill training (including multiclass). If you want to just do damage go ranger. What were you hoping to get from fighter in 3e mechanically aside from the feats?

Tempest wants Chain or lighter anyway. Go hide + dex.

In either case, focus on strength and dexterity with a bit of wisdom to use both swords and bow. If you want some more out of the other class multiclass and take a power or two for taste.

Either of these should accomplish what you could in 3e.
My original goal was to do TWFing as well as use a bow, so I was using the fighter's extra feats to persue TWFing early on, then multiclass to a Ranger at level 3 (and only gain levels in Ranger thereafter), while persuing bow fighting. The level of fighter has as much to do (at least for me) with my backstory as it does gaining any benefits... and I'm not looking to make a super powerful character. My intents are not to become the party's best tank or best ranged character, but more a hybrd of both that allows me to fall into whatever category that would be most beneficial at the time.

edit:

Should also probably mention that my original goal was to go with an extremely light armor (studded leather maybe?) and go with a high DEX, movement feats, and two weapon defense, ect. in order to go toe to toe by avoiding strikes rather than trying to absorb them.

/edit.
 
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Also, is there anyway someone could walk me through, step by step how a fighter/ranger hybrid class should be rolled/created? I have all 3 player handbooks, (though I'm guessing I only need the 1st and 3rd), but the only thing I really understand is that you can only use armor that both classes could naturally use. Everything else, including hit dies, choosing feats, ect. I'm completely confused on. Thanks again!
 
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I would say to go just with a straight Ranger using the Hunter build. That will give you Quick Draw for free and allow you to sheathe weapons as a free action, making the swap between swords and bow fast and easy. You also get a +4 to AC in Opportunity attacks against you for firing your bow at melee range. You will also remain in light armor because of what the Ranger is proficient in.

Personally, I'd avoid hybridizing to Fighter because I don't feel you gain much of anything by doing so (unless you really want to Mark creatures for some reason). You could take the Cyclone Warrior multiclass Fighter feat if you wanted (giving you a +1 to damage rolls once per encounter if wielding a weapon in each hand) but the only other thing you gain for that feat is a 6th trained skill (and your only choices for that which you don't already have access to are Intimidate and Streetwise). I myself would rather spent my feat elsewhere.
 

I ended up editting the backstory a bit, and did just go with a single classed ranger... this is what I ended up with:

STR 12
CON 12
DEX 18 (used the human +2 here)
INT 12
WIS 14
CHA 10

I selected:
Athletics
Dungoneering
Endurance
Heal
Perception
Stealth

Nimble Strike
Twin Strike
Evasive Strike
Hunter's beartrap


Thoughts/suggestions on how I allocated ability scores, bonuses, skills and feats selected are always welcome.
 

I'll talk you through building a fighter/ranger hybrid if you like. It's one of my favourite builds.

I'm assuming you are Human right? The best fighter/ranger is a half-orc but that doesn't fit with 'son of a king' really unless your playing in a rather strange campaign world.

So let's go with human. I can make you mediocre with bows but unfortunately you're going to have to be kick arse with swords, and in particular short swords.


====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&D Character Builder ======
level 1
Human, Ranger|Fighter
Hybrid Ranger: Hybrid Ranger Reflex
Hybrid Talent: Fighter Combat Talent
Fighter Combat Talent: Tempest Technique (Hybrid) [Martial Power book]
With ShortSwords and light armour this gives you a +1 Atk +2 dmg to all your melee attacks which is perfect for your 2 At Will powers that rely on having good static damage and +1 AC from the Two Weapon Defense feat which it gives you for free
Background: Born Under a Bad Sign (Born Under a Bad Sign Benefit)
Is this the sign you were born under that heralded the downfall of your family? Were you in some way the catylist of their destruction? Well if this is the case, then you base your HPs off Strength instead of CONstitution, and begin with +6 HP. When you raise STR at lvl 4, 8, 11, 12 etc each time you raise STR you gain one more HP. It doesn't affect HSurges, which are still based off CON.


FINAL ABILITY SCORES
Str 18, Con 12, Dex 16, Int 10, Wis 12, Cha 8.
I see you have gone for raising all your stats a little. For this build you will need to have good STR and DEX. Str is most important. Which leaves only 4 points to spread around. WIS and CON are the next most important. I dumped CHA. That can fit well with a rebellious nobleman's son who perhaps has a very bad temper and is still dealing with being spoilt rotten as a kid.

STARTING ABILITY SCORES
Str 16, Con 12, Dex 16, Int 10, Wis 12, Cha 8.


AC: 17 Fort: 16 Reflex: 16 Will: 12
HP: 31 Surges: 8 Surge Value: 7

TRAINED SKILLS
Endurance +6, Stealth +8, Perception +6, Athletics +9, Dungeoneering +6
As a Hybrid you will gain 1 less trained skill. From those you chose, I left out Heal. Hopefully your leader will do the healing.

UNTRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics +3, Arcana, Bluff -1, Diplomacy -1, Heal +1, History, Insight +1, Intimidate -1, Nature +1, Religion, Streetwise -1, Thievery +3

FEATS
Human: Weapon Focus (Light Blade) Your main attacks rely on building your static damage up as much as possible.
Level 1: Hybrid Talent (Totally necessary: This gives you Tempest Technique)

POWERS
Hybrid at-will 1: Dual Strike [fighter, MP]
(Defender attack. 2 different targets. Hit or miss they are both marked)

Hybrid at-will 1: Twin Strike [ranger, PHB]
(Stiker Attack, any 2 targets, Quarry Damage. Can use your Longbow with this power as well)

Hybrid encounter 1: Off-Hand Strike [Ranger, MP]
(Minor action Attack for a 3 attacks in one round combo. This also lets you combine your Fighter attacks when you want to mark, with a Ranger attack which means if it hits you can deal Quarry damage as well. Quarry damage only works with your ranger attacks.

Hybrid daily 1: Skirmishing Stance [ranger, MP2]
When you move 4 squares you get a +2 AC and REF bonus and your next attack deals +1d8 damage. When you pick up Pass Forward fighter utility at lvl 2 you can dance around your target fearlessly and cut him to pieces!

ITEMS
Hide Armour
2x Shortsword
Longbow
====== Copy to Clipboard and Press the Import Button on the Summary Tab ======

Ok, just so you know how the math works you have gained a +1 to FORT from the fighter side and +1 to REF from the ranger side.

Each level you will gain 5 hp

You have 8 healing surges.

You get Hunter's Quarry but it only works with Ranger powers

You get Combat Challenge and all your fighter powers Mark your enemy. If they shift next to you or attack someone else when you have them marked, you get a free attack on them

I have not chosen the 3rd atwill power you are entitled to as a human, because I don't think any of them are particularly vital for this build, so choose one to use with your bow, or maybe Foot Work Lure for when you need to move some enemy somewhere. Whatever you like. Personally I would take the new human racial power that has come out with essentials that grant a +4 to any given roll.

Lvl 2 Utility Pass Forward [fighter, MP] (this makes Skirmishing Stance awesome, and it's great to get into flanking position without being hurt in any case)
Feat: Two-Weapon Fighting: Gives you another +1 damage when using two weapons. This has recently been updated to apply to both weapons. It also opens up all the cool feats you will take further along

Lvl 3 Rain of Blows [fighter, PHB]
Wow, your dex and the fact you use a light blade means this gives you 3 attacks with this power, and they mark. This in combination with Off hand Strike gives you 4 attacks in one round and the chance to apply Quarry damage to Off Hand Strike. Check out what happens at level 4 with this combo!

Lvl 4 +1 STR and +1 WIS
(this gives you 13 WIS and hence the possibility to Multi class into Avenger!)
Feat: Disciple of Divine Wrath [PHB2]
(You train in Religion but mre importantly you can use the Avenger's oath 1/encounter. That means for 2 rounds vs your Oath target, for every attack you make you roll 2d20 and keep the highest one. Now think about how that works when you do Rain of Blows + Offhand Strike ACTION POINT and Twin Strike !!!

Lvl 5 Dervish's Challenge [fighter, MP2]
(3w dmg power and you enter a stance that when you make an opportunity attack or a creature triggers your combat challenge, insted of one melee basic attack, you get a second as well with your off hand. Legendary!)

Lvl 6 Utility: Serpentine Dodge [MP]/Weave through the Fray [PHB]
Feat: Swift Blade Style [Dragon Magazine 368]
If both attacks hit when you use Twin Strike you do extra damge = DEX Mod (+4)
if both attacks hit using Dual Strike you get a +2 atk and dmg bonus to OAtks until the end of your next turn


Lvl 7 Opportunist's Rend [fighter, MP2]
Dual attack that can be used instead of a Melee basic attack, so when you get an OAtk, or you charge or you get an attack triggered by Combat Challenge.

Lvl 8 +1 Str +1 DEX
Feat: Midnight Blade Student [MP2]
Dual strike now targets REF or AC. You aren't going to miss much with this power ever again!

Level 9 Fighter's Recovery [figher, MP]
good damage and recharge Rain of Blows!

Lvl 10 Resume the Hunt [ranger, MP2]
Kill someone with the first attack of Twin Strike, move over to another target and attack with the second attack; will most likely need DM approval on that interpretation!
Feat: Whatever you fancy.
I like Mobile Challenge [Dragon 378]. That really locks down ranged enemies. But it's also a good place to slot in expertise if your DM doesn't award it for free. With Essentials from what I hear, the Expertise feats (+1 Atk/tier) with chosen weapon type (Light Blade of course) comes with some neat bonus. I don't know what light blades gets, possibly a bonus to AC vs OAtks, no idea. Your accuracy is already decent but still worth considering.

Lvl 11 +1 to all ability scores
Paragon Path: Pit Fighter [PHB]
+1 AC and when you spend an action point you attacks deal extra damage = 1/2 your level (+5); put that into context with Rain of Blows. New encounter dual attack that dazes target.
Feat: Two Weapon Opening [PHB2]
When you crit with your main hand you get a free attack with your Off hand. Think about all those attacks you get with Rain of Bows, Off hand Strike etc and you Avenger Oath double rolls! You will get more crits than most people and more attacks than anyone!!!

This maybe too talented a fighter for what you are looking for. He can shoot a bow. But when he gets into combat, he is a whirlwind of destruction!

If you are worried about not having all the books to access all the powers and feats, a one month subscription to DDI gives you the Character Builder, and hence access to everything. Worth considering. Makes Hybrids a lot easier to create for sure!
 
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Whoa, information overload!... so many... questions... confused...

I'm assuming you are Human right? The best fighter/ranger is a half-orc but that doesn't fit with 'son of a king' really unless your playing in a rather strange campaign world.

So let's go with human. I can make you mediocre with bows but unfortunately you're going to have to be kick arse with swords, and in particular short swords.

Correct, he is human.

Background: Born Under a Bad Sign (Born Under a Bad Sign Benefit)
Is this the sign you were born under that heralded the downfall of your family? Were you in some way the catylist of their destruction? Well if this is the case, then you base your HPs off Strength instead of CONstitution, and begin with +6 HP. When you raise STR at lvl 4, 8, 11, 12 etc each time you raise STR you gain one more HP. It doesn't affect HSurges, which are still based off CON.

Where is this bad sign stuff at? Which book?
FINAL ABILITY SCORES
Str 18, Con 12, Dex 16, Int 10, Wis 12, Cha 8.
I see you have gone for raising all your stats a little. For this build you will need to have good STR and DEX. Str is most important. Which leaves only 4 points to spread around. WIS and CON are the next most important. I dumped CHA. That can fit well with a rebellious nobleman's son who perhaps has a very bad temper and is still dealing with being spoilt rotten as a kid.
I can understand that logic, but what happens if we reverse STR and DEX? What would the difference be in that regard, especially in improving bow skills. Also, the issue I have with Charisma, is that it also determines Intimidate (which is a skill I love).
UNTRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics +3, Arcana, Bluff -1, Diplomacy -1, Heal +1, History, Insight +1, Intimidate -1, Nature +1, Religion, Streetwise -1, Thievery +3

Intimidate -1 = sadness in my heart

Hybrid encounter 1: Off-Hand Strike [Ranger, MP]
(Minor action Attack for a 3 attacks in one round combo. This also lets you combine your Fighter attacks when you want to mark, with a Ranger attack which means if it hits you can deal Quarry damage as well. Quarry damage only works with your ranger attacks.


how is it determined if it's a ranger attack?
Lvl 7 Opportunist's Rend [fighter, MP2]
Dual attack that can be used instead of a Melee basic attack, so when you get an OAtk, or you charge or you get an attack triggered by Combat Challenge.



OAtk = AoO?


ALSO, what is this Avenger Oath? Where can I read about that?
 

Whoa, information overload!... so many... questions... confused...

Where is this bad sign stuff at? Which book?

Dragon 366, it's one of many backgrounds for the Scales of War Adventure Path from Dungeon.

I can understand that logic, but what happens if we reverse STR and DEX? What would the difference be in that regard, especially in improving bow skills. Also, the issue I have with Charisma, is that it also determines Intimidate (which is a skill I love).


Intimidate -1 = sadness in my heart
All inverting the stats would mean is a +1 to hit with melee, -1 to hit with ranged, -1 to AC/reflex, +1 to fort. It's really a matter of which will be your primary attack.

However if you're serious about being decent at both melee and bows but not great at either You could go with
str 16
con 11
Dex 16
int 8
cha 10
wis 15
You have decent attacks (especially if you stick to +3 proficiency weapons) and a decent mod on ranger powers from wisdom (+3 at paragon).

As for Charisma, you could choose Int for your 8. It's just a matter of which skills you want to nerf since Ranger never uses Int.
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how is it determined if it's a ranger attack?
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If it's a Ranger attack power.
OAtk = AoO?
Yes.

ALSO, what is this Avenger Oath? Where can I read about that?
PHB 2 but it's a specific class feature, not compatible with Ranger without some major hoop jumping.

You might want to consider a one month subscription to Dnd Insider ($10) just for the Character Builder. It's updated to all the books currently out excluding the new essentials and Dark Sun and Psionic power. It's a download so it will still work after the sub expires, it just won't be updated with future books.
 


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