Extended Extended Extended Extended Spell?

[Herzog]

I was thinking about an 'Improved Extended Spell' feat (see houserules) mainly to improve on the duration of 1-round spells without resorting to Persistent Spell, when I realised I could also just 'stack' Extend Spell....

Is that allowed?
If so, what would the durations become?
And the spell level?

My guess:

2nd lvl spell, duration 1 round, Extended 4 times:
extended 1 time: lvl 3, duration 2 rounds
extended 2 times: lvl 4, duration 4 rounds
extended 3 times: lvl 5, duration 8 rounds
extended 4 times: lvl 6, duration 16 rounds
extended 5 times: lvl 7, duration 32 rounds
extended 6 times: lvl 8, duration 64 rounds
extended 7 times: lvl 9, duration 128 rounds

and for 1r/lvl spells, that's 128 rounds/lvl for a 2nd lvl spell raised to lvl 9!

(FYI:the 2nd lvl spell I'm trying to 'boost' happens to be Hunters Eye, PH2)

Any objections?

 

[Jack Simth]

Well, by RAW, you've got:

Multiple Metamagic Feats on a Spell

A spellcaster can apply multiple metamagic feats to a single spell. Changes to its level are cumulative. You can’t apply the same metamagic feat more than once to a single spell.

(Emphasis added, specific text copy/pasted from Here).

AND you've got:

Multiplying

Sometimes a rule makes you multiply a number or a die roll. As long as you’re applying a single multiplier, multiply the number normally. When two or more multipliers apply to any abstract value (such as a modifier or a die roll), however, combine them into a single multiple, with each extra multiple adding 1 less than its value to the first multiple. Thus, a double (×2) and a double (×2) applied to the same number results in a triple (×3, because 2 + 1 = 3).

When applying multipliers to real-world values (such as weight or distance), normal rules of math apply instead. A creature whose size doubles (thus multiplying its weight by 8) and then is turned to stone (which would multiply its weight by a factor of roughly 3) now weighs about 24 times normal, not 10 times normal. Similarly, a blinded creature attempting to negotiate difficult terrain would count each square as 4 squares (doubling the cost twice, for a total multiplier of ×4), rather than as 3 squares (adding 100% twice).

(Specific Text copy/pasted from Here)

Now, whether duration is treated as a real-world value or an abstract value is up to the DM.

It's generally going to be an OK house-rule, though.

 

[StreamOfTheSky]

I've banned Persistent Spell (but kept DMM, because I never found that half of the equation to be broken -- so long as you ban Nightsticks).

So, I was thinking of making a second feat requiring Extend Spell that would increase the normal durations by one grade: round/level --> min/level --> 10 min / level --> hour / level --> 24 hours (?) --> day/level. So, grease would become a minute per level spell, and so on.

For spells with a duration of concentration + x rounds, you would double the x. Silent Image would last for concentration +2 rounds. At least, that's the plan. Might not be nearly as worthwhile as the above entensions, making the (likely +2 spell level) increase never worth it. Might just make it +5 like below.

For spells with a fixed round duration that is 2+, add 5 rounds to the duration.

Spells with a duration of instantaneous, permanent, or 1 round are unaffected by this metamagic feat.

I think that covers all the duration types. Did I miss any?

 

[Herzog]

Multiple Metamagic Feats on a Spell <snip>

I was afraid of some rule like that. (should have known to check the PHB before posting....)
Thanx!

second part becomes moot....

@StreamOfTheSky:
I just started a thread about a similar feat on the houserules forum:
http://www.enworld.org/forum/d-d-3r...-improved-extended-spell-please-critique.html

Since this (extend extend extend) obviously won't work, I'll get back to convincing my DM to let me use that Feat

 

[Christian]

Just wanted to mention that this was legal in 3.0. The stacking rule was intentionally changed for 3.5, probably because people found it abusive ... My personal favorite abuse was to stack Extend on Melf's Acid Arrow. My halfling sorcerer could toss a double-extended acid arrow with a fourth-level slot that (at 9th caster level) would last 12 rounds. I'd end up spamming it against boss monsters & with the 3.0 version of Haste, a few rounds into a combat I'd start each round spending a few minutes rolling four-siders for all of the continuing damage from the previous rounds' spells. Round 1: Haste, double-extended Acid Arrow. Round 2: Acid Arrow, double-extended Acid Arrow. Round 3 & on, rinse & repeat. About round 4 or 5, the monster would probably run away--way too late, as I'd still owe it a couple hundred points of damage. "It's dead already," I'd advise the party. "It just hasn't stopped moving yet."

So, I guess jerks like me ruined it for everybody.

 

[green slime]

I never had any problem with stacking a single metamagic feat multiple times on any spell. I still allow in it games I run.

Looking at Christians "overpowered" example:

7th level wizard:
Each requires a ranged touch attack roll to hit.
An ordinary Acid arrow (2nd level) does 6d4 damage over three rounds.
An extended Acid arrow (3rd level) does 12d4 over six rounds
An extended extended Acid arrow (4th level) does 24d4 damage over twelve rounds.

But the longer duration, also gives the recipient(s) more time to effectively counter the tactic. It is a heavy investment in the single-minded stupidity of your opponents.

A simple Dispel Magic, will end the torment immediately, for instance. Heavy rain, or a large body of other liquids, will wash away the acid.

 

[kitsune9]

I was thinking about an 'Improved Extended Spell' feat (see houserules) mainly to improve on the duration of 1-round spells without resorting to Persistent Spell, when I realised I could also just 'stack' Extend Spell....

Is that allowed?
If so, what would the durations become?
And the spell level?

My guess:

2nd lvl spell, duration 1 round, Extended 4 times:
extended 1 time: lvl 3, duration 2 rounds
extended 2 times: lvl 4, duration 4 rounds
extended 3 times: lvl 5, duration 8 rounds
extended 4 times: lvl 6, duration 16 rounds
extended 5 times: lvl 7, duration 32 rounds
extended 6 times: lvl 8, duration 64 rounds
extended 7 times: lvl 9, duration 128 rounds

and for 1r/lvl spells, that's 128 rounds/lvl for a 2nd lvl spell raised to lvl 9!

(FYI:the 2nd lvl spell I'm trying to 'boost' happens to be Hunters Eye, PH2)

Any objections?

If you were playing 3.0, you can stack metamagics on each other, but not in 3.5.