Elemental Summoning Items

[Lazybones]

Just a check on the rules for the various elemental-summoning items (e.g. the brazier of summoning fire elementals).

These items are basically unlimited-use, right? They seem rather overpowered for what they are, even at 100k gp value. A command-word, unlimited-use item for 7th level spells should cost 163,800gp by the formula in the DMG. I suppose they are considering the fact that you can only summon one at a time a limitation? I consider them 7th level items, since the condition you need to meet to get the more powerful elemental is fairly trivial in each case (with the exception of the censer, but I'd consider 4900gp for an elder elemental a pretty good trade in many cases).

If a party has one of these items, do they just basically spam the elemental at the start of every encounter?

I seem to recall these items being limited-use items back in earlier editions. I may house rule them down to 1/day or something similar.

 

[Infiniti2000]

A few points:

1. It's a sixth-level spell, not seventh. Acquiring brimstone is not defined in the rules, so whether you even allow it at all is up to you.

2. It takes a full round (not just a full round action) to speak the word PLUS you have to relight the fire. Is that like lighting a torch with a tindertwig (standard action) or just lighting a torch (full round action)? Either, it consumes another round's worth of actions (for one person). Whether two people can do it in one round is up to how you rule on simultaneity and using magic items (i.e. can I use a wand and hand it to my buddy who in the same round uses the same wand?).

3. 100,000gp is very expensive. Even without the half-wealth suggestion for a single item, this item will not be available until a high level. Two actions is a high price to acquire a single CR5 Large elemental at a time. Even with brimstone, that's only a CR7 Huge elemental. That will hardly be game breaking and IMO it is a very overpriced item. I think it would be balanced at 50-75K, arguably less.

 

[Lazybones]

A few points:

1. It's a sixth-level spell, not seventh. Acquiring brimstone is not defined in the rules, so whether you even allow it at all is up to you.

"Brimstone" is another name for sulphur, so I assumed that was what it was in this case.

 

[Infiniti2000]

"Brimstone" is another name for sulphur, so I assumed that was what it was in this case.

I realize that it's the definition, but in the world of D&D where characters can actually travel to Hell and back? Maybe real brimstone has an altogether different meaning.

In any case, is sulphur something easily attainable by characters in a D&D world? I suppose you could say that it's part of any alchemical lab. What's the cost?

 

[Lazybones]

Well, your points are reasonable in any case. I raised the question originally because the item appeared in a published module where the characters are around 9th level. It's situated right next to a "very well stocked" alchemical lab, where one would expect to find quantities of sulfur. Since the item is fairly central to the situation where it appears, I think I'll keep it, but nerf it slightly with an added limitation or two.

Thanks for the feedback.

As an added note, I was thinking about mounting a bowl of commanding water elementals on a ship... seems like such a thing could make a navy virtually invincible against most conventional foes (anything short of flying mages or a dragon attack). Salt water is definitely not an ingredient in short supply, so it's basically unlimited huge water elementals on demand.

 

[Saeviomagy]

As an added note, I was thinking about mounting a bowl of commanding water elementals on a ship... seems like such a thing could make a navy virtually invincible against most conventional foes (anything short of flying mages or a dragon attack). Salt water is definitely not an ingredient in short supply, so it's basically unlimited huge water elementals on demand.

You're more likely to encounter flying mages than own one of these.

Does that help put it into perspective?

In D&D - 'conventional' foes tend to be the minority.

 

[Lazybones]

That's true, Saeviomagy.

Heh, I suppose you'd need a bowl and the air elemental-summoning censer. Then you'd really have something. And only 200,000gp!

 

[Infiniti2000]

I raised the question originally because the item appeared in a published module where the characters are around 9th level. It's situated right next to a "very well stocked" alchemical lab, where one would expect to find quantities of sulfur. Since the item is fairly central to the situation where it appears, I think I'll keep it, but nerf it slightly with an added limitation or two.

The item certainly isn't too powerful for that level IMO, even with the brimstone being available in large quantities. Of course, the amount of brimstone required isn't specified, so it could be quite a bit. If you nerf it at all, it should be in order to reduce the cost because if I were the PC, I'd sell that thing in a heartbeat if at all possible. Even at half value, I'd much rather have something like a +5 weapon or +5 amulet of natural armor than the brazier. The brazier, IMO, is just not an adventurer's item.