D&D General Darkvision, Dim Light, and Disadvantage

[Xeviat]

Hi everybody! While I was thinking about alternate Stealth rules, I started thinking about darkvision and partial obscurement.

Seven of the ten player species in the PHB2024 have darkvision. I've seen players not play species that lack darkvision because it makes dungeon exploration harder. They also seem to forget that targets in dim light are partially obscured, but since that's just a Perception penalty it doesn't seem that bad.

What if dim light imposed disadvantage to attacks? Then there would be a reason for creatures with darkvision to use torches. You can sneak up on someone in the darkness, but if you want to fight you're going to want to light some lights. Superior Darkvision could change darkness into bright light instead of or in addition to having longer range.

Would it be too harsh to impose disadvantage on attacks against partially obscured targets? It makes sense to me; harder to see, harder to target (depth perception is weaker in dim light, for instance).

 

[Reynard]

I have always applied disadvantage to ranged attacks against targets in dim light. Now, that was a misreading of the rule, but even once we found out we decided to keep it.

Darkvision is one of those things that is best just eliminated if you actually want to make dungeon exploration worthwhile.

 

[jayoungr]

What if dim light imposed disadvantage to attacks?

Blindness already imposes disadvantage to attacks. If dim light imposes disadvantage, there's no additional level of penalty for fighting completely blind. Which you may be okay with, but just be aware that this will happen.

 

[Tales and Chronicles]

You could consider dim light as half cover and halve attack range from ranged attacks?

 

[el-remmen]

Blindness already imposes disadvantage to attacks. If dim light imposes disadvantage, there's no additional level of penalty for fighting completely blind. Which you may be okay with, but just be aware that this will happen.

I'd say the difference is that you cannot target an opponent at range or easily move towards them to attack via melee when you are blind, when you could do both without penalty when they are in dim light.

 

[Reynard]

Blindness already imposes disadvantage to attacks. If dim light imposes disadvantage, there's no additional level of penalty for fighting completely blind. Which you may be okay with, but just be aware that this will happen.

That isn't a problem with dim light, that is a problem with blindness. You should not be able to attack an opponent if you can't see.

ETA: with maybe an exception for if grappled by that opponent.

 

[Quickleaf]

I think it’s a microscopic shift that will penalize ranged darkvision PCs and no darkvision PCs. Which is fine, if you like that.

I’d be more interested in non-numerical differentiation, like defining what details CAN be noticed in bright light vs dim light vs other diminishing light levels. Eg. Faded colors, fine mechanisms, and faces under cloaks cannot be discerned in dim light.

 

[jayoungr]

I don't have a problem with attacking while blinded. The target isn't hidden, so you can still make a guess as to where they are by sound, even for a ranged attack. Disadvantage seems about right to express the "swinging/shooting wildly at a general area and hoping you connect" aspect.

 

[Tales and Chronicles]

That isn't a problem with dim light, that is a problem with blindness. You should not be able to attack an opponent if you can't see.

This.

Blindness should be: you can't target any creature (not counting yourself) or object with an effect that requires sight and attacks have advantage against you.

 

[el-remmen]

I’d be more interested in non-numerical differentiation, like defining what details CAN be noticed in bright light vs dim light vs other diminishing light levels. Eg. Faded colors, fine mechanisms, and faces under cloaks cannot be discerned in dim light.

I don't even know if this was ever actually a rule in any edition, but I have always ruled you cannot read typical text or see other fine detail with darkvision (one of the reasons dwarves carve runes, they can feel them with their hands to read, if need be).