criticals-is 19-20/x3 better than 18-20/x2?

[John Q. Mayhem]

Alright, I'm wondering about this. For some reason, it just seems to me that a crit 0f 19-20/x3 would be better than 18-20/x2 or x4. I haven't done any math, but I'm curious. The reason I ask is this: I was looking at the kukri, and it struck me that it looked rather axe-like. It really doesn't seem like it would get crits more often than a dagger or shortsword, but would rather do more damage. Opinions? (wait, that's house rules. Sorry!)

 

[Nifft]

19/x3 looks like it should be equivalent to 18/x2 or 20/x4. However, some boundry conditions make 18/x2 less desireable than 20/x4 (when one gets a Keen weapon or takes Improved Critical), particularly on iterative attacks.

(In other words: it doesn't matter if you can crit on a 15 if you can't hit on a 15.)

 

[Magic Slim]

A crit of 19-20/X3 IS better than 18-20/X2.

The difference is not big, though... a mere 4% extra damage per hit.

As to why the kukri is 18-20 and not X3, my guess is that they assumed that a curved weapon (scimitar, falchion) will have more chances of getting a crit, I guess, even though the kukri is curved the other way...

Slim

 

[Stormrunner]

A crit of 19-20/X3 IS better than 18-20/X2.

The difference is not big, though... a mere 4% extra damage per hit.

As to why the kukri is 18-20 and not X3, my guess is that they assumed that a curved weapon (scimitar, falchion) will have more chances of getting a crit, I guess, even though the kukri is curved the other way...

Slim

I DID do the math. I use the term "average-damage equivalent" (AEG hereafter) to mean that over time (and hundreds of hits) the average damage done by the two weapons should be the same or very close.
19-20/x2 is AEG to 20/x3
18-20/x2 is AEG to 20/x4
19-20/x3 would be AEG to 20/x5 or 17-20/x2. You'll notice that no weapon in the PH has such a high critical range. I would be very reluctant to allow such a weapon unless it was both a)an Exotic Weapon with no other special abilities, and b) had a base damage of no more than 1d6.
18-20/x3 would be AEG to 20/x7, 19-20/x4, or 15-20/x2. I wouldn't allow it, period.

Looking at the tables, it seems that for the most part, weapons optimized for slashing have high crit ranges, while deep-piercing weapons have high crit multipliers. The main exception is the rapier, a piercing weapon with 18-20/x2.

Sheer damage isn't everything, though. If you expect to be fighting foes with Damage Reduction, and lack the appropriate material, a weapon with a high crit multiple should at least "punch through" on the crits, whereas a weapon with a high range but low multiple may bounce off even on a crit. Conversely, any weapon with "extra" effects on a crit (vorpal, flaming burst, etc.) obviously benefits more from a high crit range.

 

[John Q. Mayhem]

Thanks. The reason I was stumped is as follows: given a base crit of 20/x2. 19-20/x2 and 20/x3 are considered equivalent, each increasing either the range or multiplier by 1. 18-20/x2 and 20/x4 are also considered equivalent, with the range or multiplier increased by 2. It seemed that increasing the multiplier and the range by 1 each would be approximately the same as increasing either by 2. Thank you for doing the math for me

 

[Magic Slim]

Thanks. The reason I was stumped is as follows: given a base crit of 20/x2. 19-20/x2 and 20/x3 are considered equivalent, each increasing either the range or multiplier by 1. 18-20/x2 and 20/x4 are also considered equivalent, with the range or multiplier increased by 2. It seemed that increasing the multiplier and the range by 1 each would be approximately the same as increasing either by 2. Thank you for doing the math for me

Think of it as an area:

You start out with a 1 inch². If you widen the square by 1 inch, you get 2 inches² (1X2). If you lengthen the square by 1 inch, you also get 2 inches² (2X1). If you widen AND lenghten the square, you now have 4 inches²

Slim

 

[AuraSeer]

I was looking at the kukri, and it struck me that it looked rather axe-like. It really doesn't seem like it would get crits more often than a dagger or shortsword, but would rather do more damage.

That's just an artifact of the way the D&D designers have chosen to represent different types of weapons.

Big damage dice go to heavy, massive weapons, because they'll inflict a lot of trauma no matter how they hit. These are things like the greatsword, greataxe, and so on.

High critical multipliers tend to be on weapons that apply lots of force in a small area. Though they may or may not do lots of damage to the body as a whole, if they hit a vital area they'll penetrate far enough to wreck something important. This applies to stuff like picks, axes, and scythes.

An increased crit chance can be for weapons that are easy to aim at a vital area, like the rapier. Or it might be for weapons that can hurt important bits even wtihout careful aiming, which applies to curved blades like the kukri and scimitar.

In the real world there's a huge difference between those weapon types, but in D&D it's not as pronounced. For game purposes, a more effective weapon does "more damage" in that it will kill a given enemy in fewer strikes; whether that damage is on every strike or only a few is not tremendously important.

 

[Sanackranib]

I think it comes down to your dice. on mine I would rather crit on a lower number and crit more often because most of the time I won't be fighting the same monster more then once so criting more often means it drops sooner.

 

[Thanee]

The area-analogy was the best example for this.

With 19-20/x2 you have 2 chances to do one instance of extra damage, resulting in a "crit potency" of 2x1 = 2.

With 20/x3 you have 1 chance to do two instances of extra damage, resulting in a "crit potency" of 1x2 = 2.

With 18-20/x2 you get a "crit potency" of 3x1 = 3.
With 20/x4 you get a "crit potency" of 1x3 = 3.
With 19-20/x3 you get a "crit potency" of 2x2 = 4.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Thanee]

In general (except for some specific cases) it is more desireable to increase the crit range, not the crit multiplier, altho both are technically the same, the chance to "waste" damage, because you don't need to do so much damage to drop an opponent, is much higher with the high crit multipliers. A more distributed extra damage with a high crit range, but low crit multiplier therefore is generally the better choice.

Bye
Thanee