Chainmail

Shin Okada

Explorer
There are a lot of cool minis which are wearing chainmail. But in 3.5e, chainmail is simply inferior to breastplate. What is worse, medium armor is not popular at all. When someone want a really nice medium armor, one tend to buy a suit of mithral full-plate.

Anyway, I am looking for some special material, magic armor property and such which can be used for chainmail but not for breastplate or full-plate. I know Celestial Armor in DMG is somewhat popular. But I want more alternatives.
 

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I happen to own a chain shirt IRL (I teach a class on how to make it at Renaissance fair).

I had a disagreement with a DM on Armor Check penalties and how they worked. He said, among other things, that you couldn't conceal chain, because of the bulk.

I took off my sweatshirt and showed him that I'd been wearing it all night. Nobody had heard it click or clink, nobody had noticed the extra 1/4 inch of "bulk".

Seems like there would be something you could do related to that property.

By the rules, magical Plate will adjust itself to fit. Other magical armors don't actually mention that property, and nobody suggests that non-magical armors do it at all.

IRL, chain armor does. As it pulls longer, it draws narrower. I've put my shirt on 12 year old kids (both boys and girls) and I've put it on men 6'4" and it fits them all.

Again, something to consider there.
 

Yeah, unfortunately 3e's lovingly detailed armour table is indeed pretty much useless - for any given character there's a pretty clear 'best' armour, with about 4 of the options covering every possible character (chainmail not being on this list). With the cost differences being sufficiently small, and WbL sufficiently generous, that everyone should be in their 'best' armour by 3rd level at the latest.

One of the things 4e did right was to make all Light armours and all Heavy armours mechanically the same as others in their class, thus making the choice of materials a matter of taste.
 

+1 to Greenfield for coming prepared!

What kind of medium armor to use? I'm preferential to +5 scale armor.

One of the things 4e did right ...
You just blew my mind.

TMI:[sblock]
Seriously though, if I find it's easy to buy mithral full-plate in a campaign, I'll be moving on to another campaign. The reason you wear maille (chain mail) is because you don't need a super-skilled craftsman to make it - just a skilled craftsman. It's probably cheaper and lighter, and has fewer weak spots than a breastplate thrown over inferior armor.

If you have an unlimited purse, and just care about what your character sheet says, yup. Go for the mithral full-plate.[/sblock]
 

You just blew my mind.

I'm not a fan of 4e overall, but it certainly had its good points.

Seriously though, if I find it's easy to buy mithral full-plate in a campaign, I'll be moving on to another campaign.

I've wrestled with the allocation, buying, and crafting of magic items for quite some time, and especially the Big Six - those items that are mechanically better, but dull.

Eventually, I settled on a solution that mostly works:

- Items can be bought or crafted normally.
- Items can be sold at 20% of base price, rather than 50%.
- I give considerably more treasure than the WbL tables say. But I specifically don't give out the Big Six items (or a few others - basically, I avoid the 'optimal' items).

This gives players a choice: they can keep what they find and have theoretically 'better' but non-optimised items, or they can sell them and buy the optimised items but end up with a lower theoretical total.

It actually worked really well with my last campaign. But then, I had a group of non-optimisers - I daresay someone determined could really break my system. :)

(The end result was that nobody even considered mithral full plate. Though there were only a couple of characters for whom it was even a possibility - the group was very caster-heavy.)
 

IRL: Chain armor converts a cutting edge to a blunt collision. Normlly you'd wear "padded armor" under it, as you would most of the other armor types.

I tend to divide armor into two categories: Soft and Hard.

Hard armor is like a hard shell. It blunts and distributes blows. Soft armor just blunts, but doesn't distribute.

In my mind the soft armors are Chain Shirt, Chain Maille, Padded and Scale. (Scale armor is scales joined by steel links, so it's almost a form of chain.)

Hard armors include Leather because leather armor isn't the same as a leather jacket. It's hardened by boiling it in oil to drive out the water. The result is a material called curaboli. It's soft and mouldable after boiling and before it cools, then it gets stiff and hard. )To do this with modern materials try soaking your "armor" in water laced heavily with Tite-bond wood glue (yellow-white stuff from the hardware store). Shape it over a form and let it dry and it will be stiff as wood.)

A breastplate or set of plate maille that isn't made for you is like trying to dance a jig in one of those inflatable sumo-suits. Except more painful. If the hard plate is an inch too wide for you your arms will hit it when you try to swing a weapon. You'll develop a chronic bruise known as "armor burn". If it's an inch too narrow you can't take a full breath. If it's too long in the torso you can't even bend enough to sit down. Your legs/lap will force the plate up under your chin. (Gods help you if you need to retrieve a dropped weapon in combat.) That's why the rules call for a skilled armor smith to modify captured plate maille.

The difference is, I'd require it (at a reduced rate) for breastplate, splint and half plate as well. You're trying to shape hard shell armor to a soft body. (Note I say "I'd require" not "I do require". Overall, I'm a "do it by the rules" guy, even when I know the rules could be improved.)

As for custom magic items: D&D has a great mechanism for limiting custom made items: Exp cost.

I know they've eliminated that in Pathfinder and 4e, and probably in 5e, but it serves a purpose. An NPC craftsman only has so much "creative energy" available, whatever he can earn through non-combat challenges encountered in normal life. Since local nobility likes their goodies, in just about any major city there is what amounts to a waiting list for such craftspeople. The rarer the craft, the longer the list. Magical jewelers (those with the Forge Ring feat) are the rarest (12th level, minimum, to get the Feat), and so there are fewer in any given city. They never lack for business.

Now enter the PC, a stranger in a strange land, with heaps of gold and little time to spend it. Seldom will they want to wait their turn in line. In some cities they may not even get a place in line. So what do they do? They curry favor from a local Lord, High Priest or Guild master, somebody who will trade places with them in line, or will authorize them to have a place in line. All for a price, of course. Typically a job they need done, though sometimes for some future service.

Yeah, I use this as a plot-hook generator. It involves the PCs in the local situation, builds them a network of allies and rivals, and gives me an easy way to hand them a mission.

Sometimes they volunteer to do a favor for a particularly powerful noble or high churchman, even when they don't need a favor. Nice to have a few banked for that rainy day, you know?

It also helps regulate how quickly the PCs can convert raw wealth into magical power, which isn't a bad thing.
 

Why would you let your PC's buy mithril full plate? Be stingier with what you hand out or what is available.

Greeny- why are you arguing over the -2 ACP? ... There's lots of things that could be nitpicked by real life items. The table is there for some game balance. A MW suit would nock that down to -1. It's cool and all that you had the shirt and what not, but keep in mind the DM may pull a real life back at you.

If you're looking for some alternate rules to add to your equipment, you could try The Black Company Campaign Setting, which turns MW items into a more filled out system.
 

Why would you let your PC's buy mithril full plate?

There are several possible reasons:

- Because you've previously established a convention that you're using item purchase guidelines as-is.

- Because you really don't want to have that argument with a player again, over something that's actually pretty trivial.

- Because the ability to buy and, especially, craft items already massively favours spellcasters, so restricting the ability of the non-caster to get the best armour just exacerbates the problem.

I'm sure there are more, but that's probably enough. :)
 

Why would you let your PC's buy mithril full plate? Be stingier with what you hand out or what is available.

Greeny- why are you arguing over the -2 ACP? ... There's lots of things that could be nitpicked by real life items. The table is there for some game balance. A MW suit would nock that down to -1. It's cool and all that you had the shirt and what not, but keep in mind the DM may pull a real life back at you.

If you're looking for some alternate rules to add to your equipment, you could try The Black Company Campaign Setting, which turns MW items into a more filled out system.

Did I complain about ACP? I was discussing concealability, though I suppose that could be seen as a comment on Move Silent.
 

Yeah, concealable would be a function of the ACP as well. Wait a sec ...It would affect any dex based skills ... BUT, I think you're more right.

if you're concealing it, wouldn't that be part of a 'disguise' which is a cha ability. Based on what you described, I wouldn't think there would be any penalty if you're simply trying to hide the fact that you're wearing [edit] light armor.
 
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